Shampoo DOES NOT CAUSE BALDNESS

[docj077]

Yes, but years and years of cumulative damage typically equals dysplasia or at the minimum metaplasia. At worst, these shampoos should cause cancer if the problem is significant enough to alter cellular growth, proliferation, and differentiation, which must be affected in order to prevent hair growth.

Excellent points Doctor...maybe this will help.
I posted it before but maybe you missed it....

http://www.rense.com/general63/nerv.htm

I've read it, but coming to a conclusion regarding hair loss by reading such websites seems to be foolish to me. The internal environment of the body and its response to toxins is a lot different from how the external environment potentially deals with the same phenomena.

In the article you posted, they gave no mention of required dosages, required times for exposure, or if topical application has been proven to cause those same problems.

When it comes to the physiology of humanity, one can not form such opinions based upon the works of such a website. Especially, when their words aren't even properly referenced.

 

[Diamond Dave]

In the article you posted, they gave no mention of required dosages, required times for exposure, or if topical application has been proven to cause those same problems.

I don't know what else you need to see Doctor...here is the first paragraph from the link I provided:

"Researchers at the National Institutes of Health have found a correlation between an ingredient found in shampoos and nervous system damage. The experiments were conducted with the brain cells of rats and they show that contact with this ingredient called methylisothiazoline, or MIT, causes neurological damage"

The first shampoo they mention is Head and Shoulders, a common shampoo recommended by a lot of you guys.
You're taking a big gamble with some of these shampoos. (your health)

 

[docj077]

[

First of all, I use baby shampoo. I use nothing else, so don't go lumping me in with everybody else. I'm simply trying to give you constructive criticism.

Like I said, they don't mention the required dosage or the required amount of exposure necessary to achieve such damage. Neurons are one of the most sensitive cell types in the body in terms of potential harm through environmental factors. It would not be surprising to see a significant change in neuronal survivability by simply putting water on them.

 

[Johnny24601]

re:

Look, the only way Diamond Dave (and others like him) will accept that shampoo has no direct effect on hairloss will be when they finally go slick bald. There are many many treatment options out there, some that have been backed by real science and others with just opinions and theories as backup. Of course, people have the freedom to choose whatever treatment is best for them and they will also suffer if they choose a useless treatment and obviously be awarded if they choose a successful treatment. At some point you just have to cut bait and let people decide for themselves.
I will say that I believe Diamond Dave's and Cudsinger's responses are right in with what I would expect from someone who could believe in the outrageous idea that shampoo causes hairloss. They use denial as their only tool IMO.
Diamond Dave and Cutsinger, I hope someday you can accept the mountain of evidence that correlates androgens to hairloss. If you do not, I believe you will be bald long before I am (and yes I will continue to use shampoo). To me this is somewhat akin to someone saying that the beginning of human life started with Adam and Eve despite the mountain of evidence supporting evolution. You cannot argue with an individual like that.......

 

[Cassin]

Thank you for your answers, however I find them unsatisfactory because they are based on opinions rather than fact. But its okay.

To all the other posters, we shouldn't give these guys such a hard time. Let them believe what they want to believe. Its not like they are trying to sell us some scam product.

End.

My thoughts exactly. They aren't selling a product, and as long as they aren't flooding the forums with the same topic over and over its cool.

I mean look, its making some of you guys think. They have some crazy ideas but they aren't selling anything.

But I would appreciate it if everyone fighting would please calm down and simply go back to arguing.

I haven't read this entire thread (not enough time) so everyone please just do me a favor and cool down ok? And I am not taking sides....

And lets not take any chest thumping stances and demand apologies...this is a forum...it aint gonna happen. int:

Group hug


:grouphug:

 

[SkylineGTR]

exactly he will defend it till his death because of stubbornness. He has it in his head that it is the truth and nothing is going to change it.

Really no point in arguing. Just leave him be. They eventually go away.

 

[Cutsinger is God]

Thank you for your answers, however I find them unsatisfactory because they are based on opinions rather than fact. But its okay.

To all the other posters, we shouldn't give these guys such a hard time. Let them believe what they want to believe. Its not like they are trying to sell us some scam product.

End.

My thoughts exactly. They aren't selling a product, and as long as they aren't flooding the forums with the same topic over and over its cool.

I mean look, its making some of you guys think. They have some crazy ideas but they aren't selling anything.

But I would appreciate it if everyone fighting would please calm down and simply go back to arguing.

I haven't read this entire thread (not enough time) so everyone please just do me a favor and cool down ok? And I am not taking sides....

And lets not take any chest thumping stances and demand apologies...this is a forum...it aint gonna happen. int:

Group hug


:grouphug:

Ok Cassin. I'll take my list down of all the people I wanted an apology from and just drop it. I will extend an olive branch out to The Gardener and say it's over and I forgive him. Gardener, please go back to being Kojak ok? No hard feelings. Certainly you can understand why I was upset at what you did and I certainly can see how you could of assumed we were the same. It's over. Let's all move on and get back to regrowing our hair. I appreciate the fine job you did Cassin at getting this resolved quickly and without further angry incidence.

Peace.

Cutsinger is God

 

[lars2004]

Ok, so i have been reading about this no-shampoo theory which should bring you back your hair.. ..so I live in Japan. People here have pretty awesome and thick hair even when they grow very old. And people in Japan actually live the longest in the world... So the supporters of the no-shampoo theory would argue that all these Japanese use no shampoo at all?
..Uhmm, i dont know about that. I think that there might be some very bad shampoos around that may cause hairloss and others that might help with it. But we cant just believe that shampoo is the one and only cause of hair loss. I think a better diet is a more fundamental factor which could help with/prevent hairloss.

 

[Pondle]

Cutsinger, Diamond Dave, read and learn...

a. Men went bald in the old days and I said this many times. There were other causes of baldness and the main thing was malnutrition. Back then people had to search for their own food. Bad diets, no food, starvation. You name it people suffered hairloss. I believe the average age of death was in the 30's and younger for cavemen. Speaking of cavemen, I am sure insects and mites also contributed to baldness before shampoo was invented. It was a entirely different time back then.

Male pattern baldness is NOT the same thing as other types of hair loss. Balding men do not 'lose' hair in the true sense of the word, but instead it gradually becomes fine and vellus. The transition of at least some terminal hairs into vellus hairs is a universal physiological secondary sexual characteristic. Clin Endocrinol 1994;40:439­57.

b. all men who use shampoo eventually do go bald. The problem with this is people die at all different ages. Some men probaby would of went bald from shampooing, they just didn't live long enough to experienc the baldness. Car accidents, cancer, etc.

The prerequisites for premature androgenetic alopecia are a genetic predisposition and sufficient levels of androgens. Eunuchs and men with 5AR deficiency do not go bald. Every white man possesses the autosomal inherited predisposition, and 96% lose hair to some degree, but because of the variabity of gene expression far fewer have appreciable premature hair loss. Am J Anat 1942;71:451­80. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1960;20:1309­18. Dawber RPR, ed. Diseases of the hair and scalp. Oxford: Blackwell Science, 1997. Ann N Y Acad Sci 1951;53:708­28

c. regarding women, see b.

Simply false.

d. All men apply shampoo pretty much the same way. They apply it to the front or the top of the heads and according to Cutsinger, this is "ground zero" for the hairloss to occur. Years and years of acid burns will eventually cause a bald spot and once it starts, it spreads, you will get the horseshoe pattern and that's the area where the shampoo is concentrated the most and for the longest periods of time. The back and the sides get very little because of gravity. The horseshoe top is where the shampoo sits flat until water washes it away. You see now.

As Doctor has said, chemicals in rinse-off shampoo products do not have sufficient time to absorb into the skin and, even if they did, there is ABSOLUTELY NO EVIDENCE that they damage hair follicles - quite the contrary, according to some of the information that Bryan has posted e.g. "Induction of hair growth by skin irritants and its relation to skin protein kinase C isoforms." Br J Dermatol 1999 Apr;140(4):616-23.

The reason why the back and sides of the head are not affected by male pattern baldness is because these regions contain far lower levels of androgen receptors. J Endocrinol. 1998 Jan;156(1):59-65.

e. I can't explain the use of androgen on scalp hair

Because you ignore the science.

just like you can't explain why Lawrence, Diamond Dave, Widowspeak, and FirestormUK are regrowing huge amounts of hair by cutting out the suds.

None of you are regrowing hair. Your hair may appear thicker because of the accumulated grease and grime, and you may have naturally reached your eventual Norwood scale rating, but you certainly won't regrow any hair. There is no biological possibility of this happening.

f. There is no proven effectivness except for some peach fuzz and great marketing by the chemical companies to young 20 somethings who don't know any better and are only worried about getting laid so they all get on drugs in order to have sex or to find a mate before they bald. Follow the money trail and you will find a pile a crap at the end of your chemical rainbow.

Wrong. We have evidence from randomised placebo-controlled trials that finasteride and dustasteride regrow hair and prevent further hair loss. This evidence has been subjected to peer review and published in reputable scientific journals.

 

[Diamond Dave]

Re: re:

Look, the only way Diamond Dave (and others like him) will accept that shampoo has no direct effect on hairloss will be when they finally go slick bald.

Sorry Johnny...My regimen has been regrowing my hair for a while now and I don't use a dangerous commercial chemical or poisonous shampoo like Nizoral.

http://www.rense.com/general63/nerv.htm

 

[Pondle]

Re: re:

Look, the only way Diamond Dave (and others like him) will accept that shampoo has no direct effect on hairloss will be when they finally go slick bald.

Sorry Johnny...My regimen has been regrowing my hair for a while now and I don't use a dangerous commercial chemical or poisonous shampoo like Nizoral.

http://www.rense.com/general63/nerv.htm

Bollocks. That source is total CRAP. Read proper scientific studies in peer-reviewed journals. Look things up on the National Library of Medicine Hazardous Substances Databank, don't trust random loonies with their own mono-maniac websites.

http://www.hairlosstalk.com/download/nizoral.pdf

The effects of chronic use of 1% ketoconazole or a 1% zinc pyrithione shampoo on the general health of hair and scalp.
Authors G. Piérard 1and G. Cauwenbergh2
Institution Department of Dermatopathology, University of Liege, Belgium.
BACKGROUND:
March 04, 2001 - American Academy of Dermatology Meeting - Washington DC - Scientists working for McNeil, makers of Nizoral anti-dandruff shampoo, presented the findings of a study done on 1% Nizoral shampoo which has good news for hair loss sufferers.
It has long been known that 2% prescription Nizoral has beneficial effects on Androgenic Alopecia (male pattern baldness). It however has been unclear whether the same benefits can be obtained by using the non-prescription 1% version.
In the study presented (see below), one hundred male volunteers with mild to moderate dandruff and somewhat oily scalp, were using, in a double-blind fashion, either a 1% Nizoral shampoo or a 1% zinc pyrithione shampoo, 2-3 times a week for 6 months.
Analysis of the different parameters set up in the study shows that the hair diameter gradually increased with Nizoral use (+8.46%) over a 6 month period, whereas the diameter showed a trend to decrease with zinc pyrithione use over the same period (-2.28%).
The sebum excretion rate was reduced with Nizoral (-6.54%) while it increased with zinc pyrithione (+8.2%) over the same period of time. The number of hair shed over a 24-hour period was reduced by 16.46% with Nizoral and 6.02% with zinc pyrithione after 6 months.
Finally, the percentage hairs in anagen phase increased by 6.4% and 8.4% respectively during the study time. The results are similar to a previous study done on 2% prescription strength Nizoral where it was shown that use of 2% Nizoral yielded a 7% average increase in hair shaft diameter similar to what was achieved by the control group using 2% Minoxidil and a non-medicated shampoo.
So for any hair loss sufferer, this research clearly indicates that using 1% or 2% Nizoral 2-3 times per week, will have positive effects on hair growth as well as controlling dandruff.
It is still unclear at this time whether it's the anti-fungal properties or the anti-androgenic properties of Ketokonazole (active ingredient in Nizoral) thats responsible for the hair thickening effects, however because of the decrease in sebum rates as well, it is the authors opinion that the results are due to the anti-androgenic properties of Ketokonazole.

Every time I see one of you post the same misinformation I will post a rebuttal of your "theory"...

a. Men went bald in the old days and I said this many times. There were other causes of baldness and the main thing was malnutrition. Back then people had to search for their own food. Bad diets, no food, starvation. You name it people suffered hairloss. I believe the average age of death was in the 30's and younger for cavemen. Speaking of cavemen, I am sure insects and mites also contributed to baldness before shampoo was invented. It was a entirely different time back then.

Male pattern baldness is NOT the same thing as other types of hair loss. Balding men do not 'lose' hair in the true sense of the word, but instead it gradually becomes fine and vellus. The transition of at least some terminal hairs into vellus hairs is a universal physiological secondary sexual characteristic. Clin Endocrinol 1994;40:439¬-57.

b. all men who use shampoo eventually do go bald. The problem with this is people die at all different ages. Some men probaby would of went bald from shampooing, they just didn't live long enough to experienc the baldness. Car accidents, cancer, etc.

The prerequisites for premature androgenetic alopecia are a genetic predisposition and sufficient levels of androgens. Eunuchs and men with 5AR deficiency do not go bald. Every white man possesses the autosomal inherited predisposition, and 96% lose hair to some degree, but because of the variabity of gene expression far fewer have appreciable premature hair loss. Am J Anat 1942;71:451-¬80. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1960;20:1309¬-18. Dawber RPR, ed. Diseases of the hair and scalp. Oxford: Blackwell Science, 1997. Ann N Y Acad Sci 1951;53:708¬-28

c. regarding women, see b.

Simply false.

d. All men apply shampoo pretty much the same way. They apply it to the front or the top of the heads and according to Cutsinger, this is "ground zero" for the hairloss to occur. Years and years of acid burns will eventually cause a bald spot and once it starts, it spreads, you will get the horseshoe pattern and that's the area where the shampoo is concentrated the most and for the longest periods of time. The back and the sides get very little because of gravity. The horseshoe top is where the shampoo sits flat until water washes it away. You see now.

As Doctor has said, chemicals in rinse-off shampoo products do not have sufficient time to absorb into the skin and, even if they did, there is ABSOLUTELY NO EVIDENCE that they damage hair follicles - quite the contrary, according to some of the information that Bryan has posted e.g. "Induction of hair growth by skin irritants and its relation to skin protein kinase C isoforms." Br J Dermatol 1999 Apr;140(4):616-23.

The reason why the back and sides of the head are not affected by male pattern baldness is because these regions contain far lower levels of androgen receptors. J Endocrinol. 1998 Jan;156(1):59-65.

e. I can't explain the use of androgen on scalp hair

Because you ignore the science.

just like you can't explain why Lawrence, Diamond Dave, Widowspeak, and FirestormUK are regrowing huge amounts of hair by cutting out the suds.

None of you are regrowing hair. Your hair may appear thicker because of the accumulated grease and grime, and you may have naturally reached your eventual Norwood scale rating, but you certainly won't regrow any hair. There is no biological possibility of this happening.

f. There is no proven effectivness except for some peach fuzz and great marketing by the chemical companies to young 20 somethings who don't know any better and are only worried about getting laid so they all get on drugs in order to have sex or to find a mate before they bald. Follow the money trail and you will find a pile a crap at the end of your chemical rainbow.

Wrong. We have evidence from randomised placebo-controlled trials that finasteride and dustasteride regrow hair and prevent further hair loss. This evidence has been subjected to peer review and published in reputable scientific journals.

 

[Johnny24601]

re:

Diamond,
Good for you. If you want to make such claims about something so experimental then you should at least post photos showing your "progress". Let's just say that at this point I question your credibility.
If anyone who has suffered through reading this particular discussion can conclude that shampoo is the monster that you claim it to be (based solely on internet theory and your speculation) then let them listen to you and waste their time, IMO. I personally believe you are doing a disservice to newbies by presenting an idea with no real scientific basis, but if they want to follow your hypothesis then I guess they deserve what they get. I belive this "theory" may resonate with many newbies because many of them have only recently noticed their hairloss and can be convinced that they can regain "control". I mean I would much rather be told that my hairloss was caused by "outside environmental factors and can easily be reversed" then "your hairloss is caused by a genetic condition that will only get worse with time".
I have found Cutsinger's answers to Pondle's questions quite absurd, though perhaps others will listen to your old wives tales. Until you present peer reviewed studies completed by reputable scientists, I will not as is my prerogative.
You constantly endorse the site getitback.us in many of your posts and I just cannot believe that you can accept what is presented in that ugly looking place. Even the forum for getitback.us is composed of many people who have accepted that this shampoo theory is bogus. In my opinion you have either been some what brain washed because of your denial that you cannot "control" your hairloss or have some sort of rooting interest in promoting that place.

 

[Diamond Dave]

Re: re:

Read proper scientific studies in peer-reviewed journals. Look things up on the National Library of Medicine Hazardous Substances Databank, don't trust random loonies with their own mono-maniac websites.

Poodle...the source of the study I posted is the National Institute of Health.
They tested the poisonous shampoos like Nizoral...Here's an excerpt:

"Why are these dangerous personal care products allowed to remain on the market? Because the FDA, which is responsible for regulating these products, spends almost no time, money or effort actually investigating the safety of such products. Instead, the FDA spends the vast majority of its time approving new prescription drugs rather than protecting the public against the dangers from such drugs or personal care products like shampoos, soaps, deodorants and fragrance products"

I'm glad to have helped you...
Diamond

 

[Diamond Dave]

Re: re:

Even the forum for getitback.us is composed of many people who have accepted that this shampoo theory is bogus./quote]

That is a total lie.

 

[Pondle]

Re: re:

Read proper scientific studies in peer-reviewed journals. Look things up on the National Library of Medicine Hazardous Substances Databank, don't trust random loonies with their own mono-maniac websites.

Poodle...the source of the study I posted is the National Institute of Health.
They tested the poisonous shampoos like Nizoral...Here's an excerpt:

"Why are these dangerous personal care products allowed to remain on the market? Because the FDA, which is responsible for regulating these products, spends almost no time, money or effort actually investigating the safety of such products. Instead, the FDA spends the vast majority of its time approving new prescription drugs rather than protecting the public against the dangers from such drugs or personal care products like shampoos, soaps, deodorants and fragrance products"

I'm glad to have helped you...
Diamond

Then explain this entry from the National Institute of Health

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/drug ... 05014.html

Cassin, how long can you tolerate this sabotage of the forum?

 

[Johnny24601]

re

Diamond, don't accuse me of lying when I just friggin read the forum. The place is haven for old wives tales. There are some people who report success, but no photos or scientific evidence as to why....shocking. The best part is that the "grunge" experts say that people need to stay grunge for as much as 5-10 years before they get results. That's right these theorists are encouraging men to wait 5-10 years and thus lose years or recession. I encourage people to investigate these issues themselves.

Copied directly from getitback.us.

"I've been on this since Jan of 2005 but nothing new to report as far as hair regrowth on my head. I am a man of integrity, honesty and I care about other people so however you feel about me I am only here to find out if this works or not thru photos and psychiatric evaluations.
Back when I said I thought my hair had stopped falling out - Well, I think I was wrong. My hair is looking woeful at the moment and I'm stuggling to draw any positives at all."


"I promised I would pop something in here. I'm almost to my 100 day mark. So far, here is what I noticed:

No oily scalp
No itching
No red spots

No regrowth of any kind"

"A few days ago I decided to tell my girlfriend what I had been doing. She immediately said, oh yea I can tell a difference!" I gave her a look and told her that I needed her HONEST opinion. So she folowed up quickly by telling me that she noticed absolutely no difference at all, and that my hair seems to be getting worse at the normal rate. I also spoke to my friend I mentioned in my initial post here. He is now approaching 1.5 years with no shampoo. Still not a single hair to speak of that has regrown."

"I'm past the 120 day mark. As before, absolutely not a thing. Hair has not accelerated it's loss or thinning as some have mentioned. It has simply continued it's thinning process at regular levels. Hair is beggining to look stupidly thin at this point, and I'm getting more and more comments from others about how "wow, you're losing your hair!" God that pisses me off when people say that! Do they tell a fat person they need to lose weight??!!

Very frustrated."

"Im at the +6month point and my hair has gotten much worse since I went grunge. I could just as easily argue that grunge made me lose my hair. I always wondered about bald guys who don't use shampoo. Why isn't their hair growing back? I'm a big hater of false hope and i get really angry when I keep going to the getitback.us website and see things like "the cause of Baldness" or "all lost hair will regrow regardless of age". How can someone say that? Based on what? Why not put "Shampoo could potentially be a factor in hair loss". Its bad enough losing your hair, its much worse thinking your doing something to grow it back but are still losing it. I think those are very irresponsible statements. My hair looks much much worse. A little more patience and Im gonna be bald."

"I'm a big hater of false hope and i get really angry when I keep going to the getitback.us website and see things like "the cause of Baldness" or "all lost hair will regrow regardless of age". How can someone say that? Based on what? Why not put "Shampoo could potentially be a factor in hair loss"

That's also what I think."


"Im going on 9 months and I'm going through pretty much what you are still. My temples have receeded slightly and my crown has gotten thinner in the area of the famous bald spot. I don't know whether or not it's gonna continue but definitely no improvement yet.

4 months grunge.

I will soon have a haircut and then it's easier to judge how my hair is doing. But right now it looks BAD!"

 

[Diamond Dave]

Re: re

Diamond, don't accuse me of lying when I just friggin read the forum. The place is haven for old wives tales. There are some people who report success, but no photos or scientific evidence as to why....shocking.

Another lie Johnny.

There are several members there with photos and you know that.
The most famous member with many photos is Widowspeak.
Widowspeak is on many forums (unfortunately not this one so you're lucky he can't call you a liar too) and his photos are on every forum he belongs too. He is at almost full regrowth at around the 3 year mark.

I won't bother to link to Widowspeak's photos because you've already seen them IF you actually went to the forum.

 

[Johnny24601]

re:

Again, people should go to that cartoon of a site and decide for themselves, don't take my word or Diamond's word.
I am just done done done with you and this subject. You and anyone else who want to believe in useless theories go right ahead.....I am done with trying to protect people from their own stupidity.
Again, how you can accept that shampoo is the defining cause of hairloss despite the mountain of evidence that it is androgen related, implies that you are psychotic IMO.

 

[Pondle]

Re: re

The most famous member with many photos is Widowspeak. Widowspeak is on many forums (unfortunately not this one so you're lucky he can't call you a liar too) and his photos are on every forum he belongs too. He is at almost full regrowth at around the 3 year mark.

I won't bother to link to Widowspeak's photos because you've already seen them IF you actually went to the forum.

"Full regrowth" is biologically impossible no matter what treatment he's on. Even if he was taking immunosuppressant drugs like cyclosporine, which apparently grow more hair than anti-androgens, it would still be impossible.

My wager is whatever regrowth this guy supposedly has is due to other treatments, or he's faking with Photoshop.

Either way HE WILL NOT REGROW ANYTHING FROM CESSATION OF SHAMPOO USE.

I repeat my rebuttal of your crappy theory, point by point:

a. Men went bald in the old days and I said this many times. There were other causes of baldness and the main thing was malnutrition. Back then people had to search for their own food. Bad diets, no food, starvation. You name it people suffered hairloss. I believe the average age of death was in the 30's and younger for cavemen. Speaking of cavemen, I am sure insects and mites also contributed to baldness before shampoo was invented. It was a entirely different time back then.

Male pattern baldness is NOT the same thing as other types of hair loss. Balding men do not 'lose' hair in the true sense of the word, but instead it gradually becomes fine and vellus. The transition of at least some terminal hairs into vellus hairs is a universal physiological secondary sexual characteristic. Clin Endocrinol 1994;40:439¬-57.

b. all men who use shampoo eventually do go bald. The problem with this is people die at all different ages. Some men probaby would of went bald from shampooing, they just didn't live long enough to experienc the baldness. Car accidents, cancer, etc.

The prerequisites for premature androgenetic alopecia are a genetic predisposition and sufficient levels of androgens. Eunuchs and men with 5AR deficiency do not go bald. Every white man possesses the autosomal inherited predisposition, and 96% lose hair to some degree, but because of the variabity of gene expression far fewer have appreciable premature hair loss. Am J Anat 1942;71:451-¬80. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1960;20:1309¬-18. Dawber RPR, ed. Diseases of the hair and scalp. Oxford: Blackwell Science, 1997. Ann N Y Acad Sci 1951;53:708¬-28

c. regarding women, see b.

Simply false. The reason why women don’t lose their hair to the same extent as men is because androgen receptor content in female frontal hair follicles is approximately 40% lower than in men, and frontal hair follicles in women have 3 and 3.5 times less 5-AR types I and II, respectively, than frontal hair follicles in men. Journal of Investigative Dermatology (1997) 109, 296–300

d. All men apply shampoo pretty much the same way. They apply it to the front or the top of the heads and according to Cutsinger, this is "ground zero" for the hairloss to occur. Years and years of acid burns will eventually cause a bald spot and once it starts, it spreads, you will get the horseshoe pattern and that's the area where the shampoo is concentrated the most and for the longest periods of time. The back and the sides get very little because of gravity. The horseshoe top is where the shampoo sits flat until water washes it away. You see now.

As Doctor has said, chemicals in rinse-off shampoo products do not have sufficient time to absorb into the skin and, even if they did, there is ABSOLUTELY NO EVIDENCE that they damage hair follicles - quite the contrary, according to some of the information that Bryan has posted e.g. "Induction of hair growth by skin irritants and its relation to skin protein kinase C isoforms." Br J Dermatol 1999 Apr;140(4):616-23.

The reason why the back and sides of the head are not affected by male pattern baldness is because these regions contain far lower levels of androgen receptors. It’s nothing to do with where you start or finish applying shampoo. J Endocrinol. 1998 Jan;156(1):59-65.

e. I can't explain the use of androgen on scalp hair

Exactly. Because you ignore the science.

just like you can't explain why Lawrence, Diamond Dave, Widowspeak, and FirestormUK are regrowing huge amounts of hair by cutting out the suds.

None of you are regrowing hair. Your hair may appear thicker because of the accumulated grease and grime, and you may have naturally reached your eventual Norwood scale rating, but you certainly won't regrow any hair. There is no biological possibility of this happening. At all. Ever. Trust science.

f. There is no proven effectivness except for some peach fuzz and great marketing by the chemical companies to young 20 somethings who don't know any better and are only worried about getting laid so they all get on drugs in order to have sex or to find a mate before they bald. Follow the money trail and you will find a pile a crap at the end of your chemical rainbow.

Wrong. We have evidence from randomised placebo-controlled trials that finasteride and dustasteride regrow hair and prevent further hair loss. This evidence has been subjected to peer review and published in reputable scientific journals.

 

[Cutsinger is God]

Dave, I find it funny that because we all don't go walking around with white lab coats acting like the professor on Gilligan's Island that what we say cannot be taken serious. How many damn scientists are here? A couple nerds that need science to back everything up. I just went to a post the other day at this place and all these guys here were talking about penis'. I saw absolutely nothing about science in what they were saying. Uk1 shows a photo of a black dildo on a toilet. I doubt he's a scientist and if he is I wouldn't want that pervert working for me.

Of all the hundreds of members at GIB that are grunge or the countless thousands doing it secretly, I know of not a single man who's a scientist. These people are there because the evidence that Lawrence layed out for everyone is solid. They also are fed up with what is currently out on the market to regrow hair which isn't much other than a lifetime of buying someone's product because once you quit, you lose everything you gained. This is not a cure but a band aid. Lawrence says he's found a CURE and we are still in the experimenting stage but there are definately people responding if you stay on it long enough.

Everything Lawrence Cutsinger, my true American Idol says makes total sense. The photos are undeniable. Widowspeak, FirestormUK and Lawrence himself who went from a bowling ball to a Norwood 7 in only 10 years and on his way in July to a Norwood 1 to the Oprah Show later this year hopefully. It's all there and I encourage everyone to check it out and sign up there and ask the regrowth guru himself and trust me he will respond if you give him some time or say something to piss him off. Lawrence is a great American folks and you really need to appreciate all the work he's done to understand the passion this man feels about this cause of his and his theory on baldness.

Listen, we might not be scientists but for many grunge works but you continue to want to focus on any negatives you can drum up. Nobody is telling everyone to go off your medication. We are just presenting facts to you based on our own experiences. Throw them in the garbage if you want, it's up to you. We are not selling a thing as Badasshairday said.