Don't Be Delusional, There Won't Be Anything Better For The Next 30 Years. Deal With It.

How long until anything better (treatment, cure...) comes?


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That Guy

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Can you elaborate on this please?

Sure, RepliCel had said in either a press release or social media (maybe it was both) several months ago, when the data was delayed, that the delay was due to waiting on a medical data analytics firm that was compiling and analyzing the data.
 

Michel F. II

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First of all, please, guys, may we keep it civilized?
Shiseido didn't "buy" it; they licensed it. A company can only license what the rights holder is willing to license.

This question can easily be flipped onto the other side of the coin: Why would Shiseido, one of the oldest and largest cosmetic firms in the world, license the technology and invest their own money and capital into building a cell-cultivating facility for a product that doesn't work?
My apologies for using a generic term.
Shiseido is a japanese company and Japanese have set their minds and hearts on everything that is related to stem cells and tissue and organ regeneration. Which in itself is great, 'cause we all know they are one of the most efficient peoples around the globe, but that also means they are willing to take risks.
And RCH-O1 might be a risky investment, might it not?
 

Michel F. II

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It's not; retarded claims that fly in the face of any fact are.
No, the FDA and the equivalent administrations need evidence; any data that gets released to the public is really just a bonus.

Do you really think that the third-party analysts who analyzed their data lied to them? Or that the company is just going to bullshit the FDA? They won't get away with it anyway and it would destroy the potential future of a company that as of right now, is not a revenue-generating company.

You're a scientific guy, so surely I don't have to explain ...
I honestly don't get this argument at all.
Don't you need solid evidence that a treatment is effective?
Do we have it?
N O
 

Michel F. II

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I'm guessing you haven't visited many subforums here if you expect it to be a reflection of reality instead of the distortion of it that it often is.
You guessed correctly.
I've never visited any other subforum, but this one
I'm only interested in related research and forthcoming treatments.
 

H

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People who just need maintenance or are just starting to recede don't really have any reason to be pessimistic they'll have something first. For people who need regrowth or new hair ya im starting to think we might be screwed.
 

That Guy

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First of all, please, guys, may we keep it civilized?

My apologies for using a generic term.
Shiseido is a japanese company and Japanese have set their minds and hearts on everything that is related to stem cells and tissue and organ regeneration. Which in itself is great, 'cause we all know they are one of the most efficient peoples around the globe, but that also means they are willing to take risks.
And RCH-O1 might be a risky investment, might it not?

It could be; I doubt there's any "safe" investment in hairloss research.

But I don't look at it from the perspective of "the Japanese" as most here do: I see it as a company who rose to become a titan in the cosmetic industry making an investment they obviously feel is worth their time and I stagger to think they'd have become such an industry player over a hundred years by making too many stupid decisions.

I honestly don't get this argument at all.
Don't you need solid evidence that a treatment is effective?
Do we have it?
N O

The argument I made is that they're not in a position where it's in their interest to forge data which I'm also fairly certain is illegal, and that the general public aren't the ones who need to see that data when something is still in clinical trials, anyway.

I'll have all the evidence I need to see when it passes the necessary trials and regulations and is approved. If it gets canned, then obviously I'll know it wasn't very good.

That being said, I do wish these companies were more transparent with the public. Follica is supposed to publicly reveal the findings of their first two clinical trials (they planned to start the pivotal study this quarter) sometime in the near future and I really wish they'd get on with it: I want to know if this thing is going to be a practical solution for me or not and the wait is brutal.

But until then, all I can do is wait for the system to do its thing and scrutinize whatever morsels of info they do give us.
 

Michel F. II

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It could be; I doubt there's any "safe" investment in hairloss research.

But I don't look at it from the perspective of "the Japanese" as most here do: I see it as a company who rose to become a titan in the cosmetic industry making an investment they obviously feel is worth their time and I stagger to think they'd have become such an industry player over a hundred years by making too many stupid decisions.



The argument I made is that they're not in a position where it's in their interest to forge data which I'm also fairly certain is illegal, and that the general public aren't the ones who need to see that data when something is still in clinical trials, anyway.

I'll have all the evidence I need to see when it passes the necessary trials and regulations and is approved. If it gets canned, then obviously I'll know it wasn't very good.

That being said, I do wish these companies were more transparent with the public. Follica is supposed to publicly reveal the findings of their first two clinical trials (they planned to start the pivotal study this quarter) sometime in the near future and I really wish they'd get on with it: I want to know if this thing is going to be a practical solution for me or not and the wait is brutal.

But until then, all I can do is wait for the system to do its thing and scrutinize whatever morsels of info they do give us.
Hallelujah, after a year of fighting one another, we've come to an agreement.
I agree with almost everything you posted.
Still, all we can do is wait and be realistic, so that we avoid another brotzu fiasco.
 

farkhairloss

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http://www.hairlosscure2020.com/shiseido-and-adenosine/

Its getting late in my part of the world. But as I said before Replicels first trial results were a joke for those that dont remember the hype before they released them. They had animated pictures of a guy growing hair back, and then after the first trial changed there tune and said they were immunizing hair. Have they actually proved thjs theory? And Shiseido who is a massive Japanese company that makes expensive hair and skin creams and shampoos. There product Adenosine which was and probably still is expensive AF, had great figures in trials and yet in reality hasnt even been as good as crappy minoxidil. Just because Shesiedo has licenced it or whatever dont mean sh1t
 

nameless

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http://www.hairlosscure2020.com/shiseido-and-adenosine/

Its getting late in my part of the world. But as I said before Replicels first trial results were a joke for those that dont remember the hype before they released them. They had animated pictures of a guy growing hair back, and then after the first trial changed there tune and said they were immunizing hair. Have they actually proved thjs theory? And Shiseido who is a massive Japanese company that makes expensive hair and skin creams and shampoos. There product Adenosine which was and probably still is expensive AF, had great figures in trials and yet in reality hasnt even been as good as crappy minoxidil. Just because Shesiedo has licenced it or whatever dont mean sh1t

I agree. That's why I said the most I really expect from Shiseido/Replicel is a slim chance they might arrest hair loss. Now that having been said, you have to keep in mind that unlike Replicel, Shiseido is using repeat follow-up injections so there is also a slim chance that Shiseido might get better results. Anytime you change a protocol you can get a different result from the previous result.
 
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Spanishboy97

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If they believe the hair loss is arrested because the affected cells are being replaced with inmune cells from the back and they have 5 year data to prove that I don't know why you think otherwise. Unless you think they lie on the info they release
 

nameless

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If they believe the hair loss is arrested because the affected cells are being replaced with inmune cells from the back and they have 5 year data to prove that I don't know why you think otherwise. Unless you think they lie on the info they release


1) Are you saying they've released their 5-year data showing they arrested hair loss?

2) Their patient sample size of 19 test subjects is too small to apply the results to the larger market.
 
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Feelsbadman.jpg

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why aren't any other companies buying it, except for Shiseido?

Because Shiseido already bought it.......

Or, as that guy correctly stated, Shiseido has already bought the license to use it and they have exclusive rights to it in Asia while Replicel plans to bring it to market in the West.
 

nameless

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There will be no better treatement coming out for the next 30 years? I find that hard to believe. Hair loss is a big market with people becoming more and more obsessed with their appearance.

I agree that treatments will come sooner than 30 years, especially now that human gene-editing studies are starting but some guys are way too optimistic. There are dumb guys already declaring Shiseido a success for stopping hair loss based on study results involving only 19 test subjects.
 
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nameless

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You're new here; newer than even I, so let me tell you this: There are a lot of crazy people here who flat out do not want anything better to come along.

In the past two pages and in recent threads we've seen:

• At least one person who doesn't think RepliCel or Shiseido will make it, but provides no explanation other than "just a feeling"

• Another person who claims there is a slim chance that said company can arrest hairloss, despite all evidence thus far indicating it can do just that.

• People who argue that JAK inhibitors will cure hairloss, but fail to provide an explanation as to how this will regenerate the hair follicle organ and actually believe that a topical will work for Androgenetic Alopecia because "it can better reach the follicle" and somehow still believe this when shown actual scientific studies that oral JAK (much like finasteride and other drugs) has absolutely no problem reaching the follicle and toward the outermost skin.

When it comes to New Research, there are many who are downright ideologues to whom facts do not matter.

They want to wallow in self pity and believe nothing is happening and it won't matter what breakthroughs happen or how many successful trials we see — they'll still say the same things.


How unintelligent. What do you mean by "...all evidence thus far". You say that as though there's a ton of publicized evidence.

Oh you're talking about Replicel's 24-month results of their phase 1 study that involved a whopping 19 patients. A lot of companies call 19 test subjects a pilot study. The small sample of patients in this study is too small to apply the results to the larger market.

Give me a break already.
 
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Feelsbadman.jpg

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There are dumb guys already declaring Shiseido a success for stopping hair loss based on study results involving only 19 test subjects.

Shiseido has not yet released any results from their phase II study or any study period. Are you referring to the study done by Replicel? If so, then your comment should read "There are dumb guys already declaring Replicel a success for stopping hair loss based on study results involving only 19 test subjects."

Surely though, with your vast intellect, you were aware of this. It must be that I am too simple minded to understand what you meant. That is the only logical explanation right?
 

nameless

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Shiseido has not yet released any results from their phase II study or any study period. Are you referring to the study done by Replicel? If so, then your comment should read "There are dumb guys already declaring Replicel a success for stopping hair loss based on study results involving only 19 test subjects."

Surely though, with your vast intellect, you were aware of this. It must be that I am too simple minded to understand what you meant. That is the only logical explanation right?

It's my understanding that Shiseido is using the same treatment as Replicel. Hence, that means the treatment that Shiseido is using has accomplished nothing so far other than to arrest hair loss in 19 test subjects. Whoop dee doo.
 
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Feelsbadman.jpg

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I transposed the wrong company name into the sentence. Whoop dee doo.

While calling other people dumb.....


In any case, it's my understanding that Shiseido is using the same treatment as Replicel. Hence, that means the treatment that Shiseido is using has accomplished nothing so far other than to arrest hair loss in 19 test subjects.

Now that having been said, you have to keep in mind that unlike Replicel, Shiseido is using repeat follow-up injections so there is also a slim chance that Shiseido might get better results. Anytime you change a protocol you can get a different result from the previous result.

Really? Don't call other people dumb. You are of average intelligence. You should know that by now.
 
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