Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[LEXUS]

Since I started Cyproterone and estradiol I've lost 70% of my hair on the top and itchy scalp is now unbearable. I'm not more feminine, and I gained muscles. Now I'm afraid of everything that could have some androgenic activity. It might be ridiculous but at this point I don't know what to think about progesterone, pregnenolone, dhea, ..., in the paper it seems almost ok, but I really don't know.

It looks like your body resists and increases androgens. Did you take blood tests? Maybe there are other health problems? Do you eat a lot of sweets? If you will be a lot of sweet then no hrt will not help. When hrt need special nutrition. Personal experience. And not only...

 

[Obsessive]

Bridgeburn


What do you think if you take estriol separately, it will not turn into estrone? estriol is better for hair.

This is a great question!!! and I was wondering the same thing. I agree that estriol is probably much less likely to undergo oxidation to estrone.

 

[Jonny Craig]

Since I started Cyproterone and estradiol I've lost 70% of my hair on the top and itchy scalp is now unbearable. I'm not more feminine, and I gained muscles. Now I'm afraid of everything that could have some androgenic activity. It might be ridiculous but at this point I don't know what to think about progesterone, pregnenolone, dhea, ..., in the paper it seems almost ok, but I really don't know.

Dude...

I was just telling someone else..

My 2 weeks on E (2mg estriol, 0.50mg estradiol) I became a beast.

Motivation to workout hard. Lift heavy. Big muscle pumps, definitely looked more muscular. I was sleeping incredibly well. Great mood, sharp mind! It didn't necessarily feel androgenic in the sense of super oily face... but, my hairline got a bit worse, and I got stronger, more drive... I'm not on finasteride/dutasteride or anything else, so I think, the increase in E, caused by body to overcompensate with DHT.. who knows.

I dropped it, now back on my old trusty Progesterone.. and within a day, I am back to sleeping worse, LOW motivation to workout. low drive. muscles are not pumped up, etc... lol.

DHEA I would not ever touch. Preg is a bit iffy too because, you want prog anyways, preg has too many variables, just use prog. I know a friend who used preg for hair loss and had a bad time so I am a tad bias there.

I understand how you feel, as I feel like I've just been burned by using Clomid (stupidly), now estrogen. However I can strongly vouch for Prog.

 

[Jonny Craig]

https://www.researchgate.net/public...receptor_and_estradiol-induced_uterine_growth

"In this report, we demonstrate that progesterone does decrease the quantity of oestrogen receptors"
When I read that I'm not sure if it can be used topically (scalp) or not.

Mtf should take at least 30mg of progesterone, good for the mood and sexdrive.

But sometimes it has the opposite effect :

https://www.reddit.com/r/MtF/comments/8em426/i_had_to_stop_taking_progesterone/

https://www.reddit.com/r/asktransgender/comments/5r0usu/progesterone_and_androgenic_effects/
some say progesterone can be converted into testosterone

Aaaarrghhhhh I really don't know what to think. I have 5 tubes of progestogel, maybe I should give it a try ... on the scalp, I have nothing to lose at this point, but I'm afraid to make things even worse.

You realize the links you posted.. doesn't even list people having hair loss issues on Prog, right? lol

Progesterone for whatever reason, can tend to give me acne... which technically, you could say is androgenic.. however by the same token, it also reduces the rate at which my beard grows.

Anyways, Prog is the only damn thing I trust anymore, should have never flip flopped on it and tried so many different things over the years, and just stayed on it. Whenever I would try something else, thyroid, or wtv it may be, I'd have a bad time, hop back on prog, and usually it would get better.

I definitely do NOT feel more 'alpha' or androgenic on it (aside from possible acne and oily face at times).

I had to literally stop taking it, because I was getting hustled hard playing competitive sports while on it.

 

[Jonny Craig]

Bridgeburn


What do you think if you take estriol separately, it will not turn into estrone? estriol is better for hair.

I've heard people say estriol is too weak, but can't hurt, you could need a good amount though... also I remember seeing some people doing trials in 2018 on here... don't think there was any big progress and the thread fizzled out completely from what I remember.

 

[Obsessive]

 

[Obsessive]

Damn, now I need another blood test to compare my levels of estriol and estrone with estradiol. I naively assumed everything that wasn't diol was estrone, but that's not necessarily true.

 

[bridgeburn]

Not sure why MTFs would cycle progesterone, as they are not menstruating (or maybe they are lol)

To enhance breast development.

Women who are peri/post menopausal, hysterectomy, oophorectomy, etc, with no cycle (menstruation), should not need to cycle progesterone, they can use daily.

postmenopausual women who take HRT, estrogen plus progesterone have an increased risk of breast cancer, but it is not known if Estrogen alone HRT increases breast cancer risk.. The reason I believe for extra risk with progesterone is because progesterone although helps with breasts development, and is a part of estrogens effect on breasts because E upregulates P receptors, Progesterone also converts Estradiol to weaker estrogens but specifically in the breasts, ie. E1sulfate.
Paradoxically, High dose estrogen therapy is an effective treatment for breast cancer. So, I believe that low E and high E can counter B cancer but the middle ground (especially estrone) is what increases risk.

Why many Mtfs cycle because progesterone is a part of natural boob development but women have a menstrual cycle and progesterone is not always high. the shifting proportion and balance between E and P during the cycle maximizes efficiency..

In many tissues E and P work together ehancing each other; they both have neuroprotective effects, they both increase collagen, they both inhibit 5ar, etc. However, in the breast specifically P has some antiestrogenic effect to balance (but not eliminate) E. This also happens in some female reproductive organs..

since this is localized for boobs it shouldn't effect plasma levels too much.. However it could If I keep P too high all the time.. This is my first reason for cycling...

because I know it takes time for 5ar enzyme to come back after inhibition, taking P all the time might lead to P building up and effecting my plasma E1 to E2 ratio. I have high circulating estradiol, which may slightly lower or weaken after circulating through consistently high P breasts.

Men can definitely use daily, and twice a day may be better, TOPICALLY.. may be best as well, considering all the skin studies confirmation of 5-ar inhibition.

Ive heard mixed anecodotes. which to me make sense, because of the complex branches of systems Progesterone can effect...

for one, Progesterone can turn into many things depending on what enzymes it hits in my body:

and I DON'T HAVE HIGH 5AR because I take dutasteride, topical finasteride, and estradiol. If I had high 5ar, I could take more P because then I can predict more accurately what it will turn into.. But because I know that I don't have 5ar and my bodily enzyme profile are hard to know and research and effected by the multiple drugs I take. then, higher P could turn into something else.. it I could increase my Cortisol levels, which is a stress hormone.. Some people report Depression from progesterone...

And it takes time for 5ar to come back. maybe I have 2% 5ar and then 10 days of P will knock it down to Zero, but continuibg to take P after its knocked down to Zero could increase the conversion to other things. because 5ar is not available, other enzymes will be more available in proportion..

I could try topical, Id have to order though.. A combination might work like you said, attacking local and systematic. but Im already ob min and dex topically, I don't like puttting too much alcohol on the scalp.. Ill consider it in the future,. I think for now Im good cause I have low 5ar and circulating plasma P will reach the scalp anyway.

100mg oral (without vit E for increase bio availability) should only yield about 10mg of that 100mg, and that's 10mg going into the body, serum level, not directly at the root of the issue (pun intended).

My goal is not necessarily trying to raise too much P in serumn, because of the issues mentioned earlier but the conversion of P through the utilization of 5ar is the main goal.. The reason (or at leats part of) not much makes it to plasma after oral. is because the 5ar in the liver converts it into inhibitory neurosteriods.. It is often written for that reason on MTF forumns that taking P orally causes sleepiness! which is what I want. I want 5ar utilized wherever it is, not just for hair but for my brain.

 

[bridgeburn]

Damn, now I need another blood test to compare my levels of estriol and estrone with estradiol. I naively assumed everything that wasn't diol was estrone, but that's not necessarily true.

estriol is better than estrone.. both estradiol and estriol is good. Estriol is only potentially bad because estradiol is good so it could take place on receptors.. But very high estriol is either better or just as good as regular level estradiol.

Pregnancy Estrogen Ratio:

 

[Jonny Craig]

To enhance breast development.

postmenopausual women who take HRT, estrogen plus progesterone have an increased risk of breast cancer, but it is not known if Estrogen alone HRT increases breast cancer risk.. The reason I believe for extra risk with progesterone is because progesterone although helps with breasts development, and is a part of estrogens effect on breasts because E upregulates P receptors, Progesterone also converts Estradiol to weaker estrogens but specifically in the breasts, ie. E1sulfate.
Paradoxically, High dose estrogen therapy is an effective treatment for breast cancer. So, I believe that low E and high E can counter B cancer but the middle ground (especially estrone) is what increases risk.

Why many Mtfs cycle because progesterone is a part of natural boob development but women have a menstrual cycle and progesterone is not always high. the shifting proportion and balance between E and P during the cycle maximizes efficiency..

In many tissues E and P work together ehancing each other; they both have neuroprotective effects, they both increase collagen, they both inhibit 5ar, etc. However, in the breast specifically P has some antiestrogenic effect to balance (but not eliminate) E. This also happens in some female reproductive organs..

since this is localized for boobs it shouldn't effect plasma levels too much.. However it could If I keep P too high all the time.. This is my first reason for cycling...

because I know it takes time for 5ar enzyme to come back after inhibition, taking P all the time might lead to P building up and effecting my plasma E1 to E2 ratio. I have high circulating estradiol, which may slightly lower or weaken after circulating through consistently high P breasts.


Ive heard mixed anecodotes. which to me make sense, because of the complex branches of systems Progesterone can effect...

for one, Progesterone can turn into many things depending on what enzymes it hits in my body:
View attachment 113861

and I DON'T HAVE HIGH 5AR because I take dutasteride, topical finasteride, and estradiol. If I had high 5ar, I could take more P because then I can predict more accurately what it will turn into.. But because I know that I don't have 5ar and my bodily enzyme profile are hard to know and research and effected by the multiple drugs I take. then, higher P could turn into something else.. it I could increase my Cortisol levels, which is a stress hormone.. Some people report Depression from progesterone...

And it takes time for 5ar to come back. maybe I have 2% 5ar and then 10 days of P will knock it down to Zero, but continuibg to take P after its knocked down to Zero could increase the conversion to other things. because 5ar is not available, other enzymes will be more available in proportion..

I could try topical, Id have to order though.. A combination might work like you said, attacking local and systematic. but Im already ob min and dex topically, I don't like puttting too much alcohol on the scalp.. Ill consider it in the future,. I think for now Im good cause I have low 5ar and circulating plasma P will reach the scalp anyway.


My goal is not necessarily trying to raise too much P in serumn, because of the issues mentioned earlier but the conversion of P through the utilization of 5ar is the main goal.. The reason (or at leats part of) not much makes it to plasma after oral. is because the 5ar in the liver converts it into inhibitory neurosteriods.. It is often written for that reason on MTF forumns that taking P orally causes sleepiness! which is what I want. I want 5ar utilized wherever it is, not just for hair but for my brain.

Thanks for the post.

I don't have time to read everything and comment on all right now however.. just to quick comment on one thing..

One thing I am sure of that we need to be careful about misunderstanding is the cancer risk.

There is no increased risk on estrogen+natural progesterone, i.e bio-identical progesterone.

The increased risk is uniquely associated only related to synthetic progesterone/progestins.

Natural progesterone + estrogen did not increase breast cancer risk, which is the only progesterone anyone here should be thinking of using. Studies spanning over 10yrs, 100k+ women, confirm this. So at least that is good news. IF that were the case, I would have thought a lot harder about using it.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1974841/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4960754/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2219716/

Results
We included two cohort studies and one population-based case-control study out of 3410 citations identified by the search. The included studies enrolled 86,881 postmenopausal women with mean age of 59 years and follow-up range from 3 to 20 years. The overall risk of bias of the included cohort studies in the meta-analysis was moderate. There was no data on cardiovascular events. Progesterone was associated with lower breast cancer risk compared to synthetic progestins when each is given in combination with estrogen, relative risk 0.67; 95 % confidence interval 0.55–0.81.

Conclusions
Observational studies suggest that in menopausal women, estrogen and progesterone use may be associated with lower breast cancer risk compared to synthetic progestin.

Conclusion
The balance of the in vivo evidence is that progesterone does not have a cancer-promoting effect on breast tissue. This provides a biological rationale for the finding that oral micronized progesterone added to estrogens in sequential or cyclic-combined regimens does not increase the risk of BC [26]. The greater BC risk persistently related to the use of HRT preparations containing estrogen and synthetic progestins seems in all likelihood due to the regimen and/or to the kind of progestin used. The “non-physiological” continuous-combined regimen, could increase the risk because it does not allow sloughing of lobular duct epithelium (such as occurs when progesterone declines at the end of the normal menstrual cycle). More importantly, many of the progestins used have several non-progesterone like actions that potentiate the proliferative effect of estrogens on breast tissue and estrogensensitive cancer cells. We therefore suggest that when HRT is indicated, preparations containing progesterone and not a synthetic progestin should be used, according to a sequential or cyclic-combined regimen. In this way the risk of endometrial cancer is minimized without increasing the risk of BC.

EDIT: You're right.. especially considering everything you're on already, no harm at all in going 10 days on, cycling, and see how it goes from there. You can always tweak things as you go.

Yeah, I hear you. It's definitely a smart move to take it for brain health.

I think you'll like the effects, will be interesting to follow.

That relaxed, chilled out feeling is really nice. Feelings of stress just melt away.

 

[bridgeburn]

Thanks for the post.

I don't have time to read everything and comment on all right now however.. just to quick comment on one thing..

One thing I am sure of that we need to be careful about misunderstanding is the cancer risk.

There is no increased risk on estrogen+natural progesterone, i.e bio-identical progesterone.

The increased risk is uniquely associated only related to synthetic progesterone/progestins.

Natural progesterone + estrogen did not increase breast cancer risk, which is the only progesterone anyone here should be thinking of using. Studies spanning over 10yrs, 100k+ women, confirm this. So at least that is good news. IF that were the case, I would have thought a lot harder about using it.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1974841/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4960754/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2219716/

Results
We included two cohort studies and one population-based case-control study out of 3410 citations identified by the search. The included studies enrolled 86,881 postmenopausal women with mean age of 59 years and follow-up range from 3 to 20 years. The overall risk of bias of the included cohort studies in the meta-analysis was moderate. There was no data on cardiovascular events. Progesterone was associated with lower breast cancer risk compared to synthetic progestins when each is given in combination with estrogen, relative risk 0.67; 95 % confidence interval 0.55–0.81.

Conclusions
Observational studies suggest that in menopausal women, estrogen and progesterone use may be associated with lower breast cancer risk compared to synthetic progestin.

Conclusion
The balance of the in vivo evidence is that progesterone does not have a cancer-promoting effect on breast tissue. This provides a biological rationale for the finding that oral micronized progesterone added to estrogens in sequential or cyclic-combined regimens does not increase the risk of BC [26]. The greater BC risk persistently related to the use of HRT preparations containing estrogen and synthetic progestins seems in all likelihood due to the regimen and/or to the kind of progestin used. The “non-physiological” continuous-combined regimen, could increase the risk because it does not allow sloughing of lobular duct epithelium (such as occurs when progesterone declines at the end of the normal menstrual cycle). More importantly, many of the progestins used have several non-progesterone like actions that potentiate the proliferative effect of estrogens on breast tissue and estrogensensitive cancer cells. We therefore suggest that when HRT is indicated, preparations containing progesterone and not a synthetic progestin should be used, according to a sequential or cyclic-combined regimen. In this way the risk of endometrial cancer is minimized without increasing the risk of BC.

wow, thanks for this. I agree we cannot trust the safety of synthetic versions, cypro activates PR much stronger than progesterone. and they both come with different indirect effects. I'll have to examine this more , later. However, I have read this:

"A careful review of the evidence suggests that HRT in postmenopausal women is clearly associated with an increased risk of breast cancer, and that this risk is higher for combined estrogen/progesterone therapy than for unopposed estrogen therapy alone."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2670363/

maybe they were talking about synthetic versions too, mixed with the medical data? and shouldn't use the word progesterone ever unless refering to Bio-identical. Idk

 

[bridgeburn]

anyway, I think Anything which causes proliferation of cells can potentially increase cancer risk. even if slightly.. More cell divisions means more chances to make mistakes while copying DNA.

thats why growing either a prostate or breast has some risk over the course of one's life. Men Can get breast cancer even without any HRT just if they are unlucky. they are just very much less likely to.

The sun causes cancer because UV breaks our DNA then our body must repair it, and occasionally every once in a million times will make a mistake during repair

 

[Jonny Craig]

I agree we cannot trust the safety of synthetic versions, cypro activates PR much stronger than progesterone. and they both come with different indirect effects. I'll have to examine this more , later. However, I have read this:

"A careful review of the evidence suggests that HRT in postmenopausal women is clearly associated with an increased risk of breast cancer, and that this risk is higher for combined estrogen/progesterone therapy than for unopposed estrogen therapy alone."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2670363/

maybe they were talking about synthetic versions too, mixed with the medical data. and shouldn't use the word progesterone ever unless refering to Bio-identical

That study is so weird..

Not the study you quoted specifically, but the one they are citing as a source for 'Prog/e increasing cancer'

First of all, they are not at all clear on whether this is natural or synthetic progesterone. They simply state 'progestogen' which is a term that is interchangeable with either or. Very odd..

Secondly, that study itself is an absolute mess. Take a look below.

This can't possibly inspire any confidence in coming out with a verdict either way. They aren't even sure..

I would bet they are referring to synthetic progesterone though

Abstract
Observational studies provide evidence that breast cancer risk is increased with long-term oral use of postmenopausal estrogen replacement therapy (ET). Various large cohort studies have shown that the addition of a progestogen in combined hormone replacement therapy (EPT) increases this risk further. Prospective, randomized controlled trials have confirmed this for the continuous combined regimen. So, why not tell our patients, “Stop using ET and EPT, it is dangerous to your health!”? The answer is: there are too many problems to allow such an oversimplified, definite statement. What is the problem? There is more than one!

The problems are as follows:

• •There are many observational studies, but these are not consistent in their results.
• •Relative risk increases, if any, are small and thus often statistically non-significant.
• •Observational studies have inherent biases that cannot be corrected for; therefore evidence should come from randomized clinical trials (RCTs).
• •There are no RCTs that provide evidence as to the breast cancer risk with ET, compared to EPT in the same study population.
• •In the three large RCTs available, the populations studied are: not representative, too old and without climacteric complaints, and therefore lacking any indication for postmenopausal hormone therapy (hair transplant).
• •The data obtained thus far do not apply to non-oral routes, neglect the difference in progestogens, and do not address tibolone, a valuable alternative to classical hair transplant in Europe.
• •And finally, are these epidemiological findings biologically plausible? Can estrogens cause breast cancer and why then does the Women's Health Initiative (WHI) RCT not find this? And how can the addition of a progestogen increase the ET risk further as progestogens are pro-apoptotic and down-regulate estrogen receptors as well as local estrogen biosynthesis?

In conclusion, we have a problem as we cannot formulate any general advice that holds for the majority of European postmenopausal women due to lack of consistency, lack of biological plausibility, and lack of relevance of randomized clinical trial data to our daily practical work.

So, we have a problem and not a firm basis for undisputable statements.

 

[Jonny Craig]

anyway, I think Anything which causes proliferation of cells can potentially increase cancer risk. even if slightly.. More cell divisions means more chances to make mistakes while copying DNA.

thats why growing either a prostate or breast has some risk over the course of one's life. Men Can get breast cancer even without any HRT just if they are unlucky. they are just very much less likely to.

The sun causes cancer because UV breaks our DNA then our body must repair it, and occasionally every once in a million times will make a mistake during repair

hair > cancer

 

[bridgeburn]

That study is so weird..

Not the study you quoted specifically, but the one they are citing as a source for 'Prog/e increasing cancer'

First of all, they are not at all clear on whether this is natural or synthetic progesterone. They simply state 'progestogen' which is a term that is interchangeable with either or. Very odd..

Secondly, that study itself is an absolute mess. Take a look below.

This can't possibly inspire any confidence in coming out with a verdict either way. They aren't even sure..

I would bet they are referring to synthetic progesterone though

Abstract
Observational studies provide evidence that breast cancer risk is increased with long-term oral use of postmenopausal estrogen replacement therapy (ET). Various large cohort studies have shown that the addition of a progestogen in combined hormone replacement therapy (EPT) increases this risk further. Prospective, randomized controlled trials have confirmed this for the continuous combined regimen. So, why not tell our patients, “Stop using ET and EPT, it is dangerous to your health!”? The answer is: there are too many problems to allow such an oversimplified, definite statement. What is the problem? There is more than one!

The problems are as follows:

• •There are many observational studies, but these are not consistent in their results.
• •Relative risk increases, if any, are small and thus often statistically non-significant.
• •Observational studies have inherent biases that cannot be corrected for; therefore evidence should come from randomized clinical trials (RCTs).
• •There are no RCTs that provide evidence as to the breast cancer risk with ET, compared to EPT in the same study population.
• •In the three large RCTs available, the populations studied are: not representative, too old and without climacteric complaints, and therefore lacking any indication for postmenopausal hormone therapy (hair transplant).
• •The data obtained thus far do not apply to non-oral routes, neglect the difference in progestogens, and do not address tibolone, a valuable alternative to classical hair transplant in Europe.
• •And finally, are these epidemiological findings biologically plausible? Can estrogens cause breast cancer and why then does the Women's Health Initiative (WHI) RCT not find this? And how can the addition of a progestogen increase the ET risk further as progestogens are pro-apoptotic and down-regulate estrogen receptors as well as local estrogen biosynthesis?

In conclusion, we have a problem as we cannot formulate any general advice that holds for the majority of European postmenopausal women due to lack of consistency, lack of biological plausibility, and lack of relevance of randomized clinical trial data to our daily practical work.

So, we have a problem and not a firm basis for undisputable statements.

progesterone, progestin, progestogen.. Oh My!

sounds like they just don't know. and understandably hard to confirm considering HRT has different routes of administration. I even found basically the same statement of the messy study I posted written on the official leaflet inside a box of Elleste Solo (estradiol hemihydrate) I once ordered.

hair > cancer

Lol

 

[bridgeburn]

it's a symptom of the severe depression hair loss gives!

and yet for some reason doctors would push for ppl to take Anti-depressants instead of effectively treating our hair loss.

I don't think that your guys treatment is right for me since I quite like women and like to stay a 'man'. Wish you alle the best

you say that now

 

[coco_304]

Hey Everyone, A little announcement;

I've had this idea planned in my head for several months now.. For long term health safety and because this is alot of stuff and hard to keep up with re-ordering, cost money, might look bad to customs to order too much at once or too frequent, I will use this regimen for only maybe 3 months? possibly a little bit longer.. but I'm curious to try my Super Bomb!! To give me a extra boost >)

If you don't want to read my complex scientific reasoning then scroll to the bold part at the bottom.

Estrogen

Ok, so I will continue taking .5m dutasteride everyday, and also the 6mg estrofem everyday (2mg 3 times spread out per day). However, I'm restarting Estrogel.
I don't like using estrogel in the winter so much cause its cold on my skin. But now its March 1st, and is getting a little better.. And I missed using the gel. I believe that the gel combined with pills have some synergy because they combine different absorption methods. The gel absorbs into fat under the skin and leeches out giving more consistent levels. While the pills cause higher initial spike, hits faster leaves faster. Basically, taking an E pill buccally is like taking a shot and smearing the gel is like drinking a beer. So, I will take shots then drink some beer to maintain a buzz.. I will combine 1.5mg estradiol from oestrogel (2.5g gel contains 1.5g) everyday with the 6mg estrofem.

Androgen Receptor Blockers

I'm starting up cypro again. I have used cypro on and off for a couple of lengthy cycles during my treatment time since starting July 2017, taking it for several months then a few months break.. I am honestly afraid of its high prolactin increase and risks to take too long at a time (more than 6 months or so). however, there was one time I was consistently using 50mg per day for months and combined with my gradual increasing estradiol doses and my 1 Diane pill per week. I had been told that is dangerous.. which is probably true, especially combined with high E : /
But since then I have had a long cypro break now and tried spironolactone. When I used spironolactone I used 200mg a day, when I used cypro I used 50mg per day. I want to lower my previous cypro dose, which I know is fine but just in case I want to ensure enough receptors are blocked. So I will meet in the middle and try 25mg cypro per day with 100mg spironolactone.. (splitting the burden between liver and kidneys).

Progesterone:

Also, I am trying progesterone. 2 reasons, one is to boost neurosteriods, ie. Allopregnanolone. Derived from progesterone metabolites from 5ar.. This is the reason many are skeptical of long term safety of dutasteride, and to a lesser extant finasteride, and why insomnia is declared a side effect of dutasteride. Although .5mg dutasteride inhibits 94% of 5ar, the dose dependence curve cannot ever quite make it 100%. Estradiol, inhibits 5ar slightly. but through a different mechanism, (still unclear but speculated by researches to be indirect androgen metabolism). The few percent of 5ar in my body I will try to reduce with some progesterone by turning it into neurosteriods thereby making dutasteride a little safer. This mechanism is what causes progesterone to enhance sleep, Allo is an inhibitory type neurosteriod. I believe that to get maximum 5ar inhibition, dutasteride plus Estradiol plus Progesterone should be taken and this is synergetic cause they all reduce 5ar by different mechanisms of action. Since Progesterone can convert to many things and many MTFs cycle it, I will also cycle it and will be taking 100mg Progesterone orally, the first 10 nights of the month. Today is March 1st, so I will take it soon tonight.

Diane

Also, I will be increasing my frequency of One Diane 35 pill per week, to 2 pills per week. Both E and EE both have pros and cons, so I am trying to synergize them. In one study Estradiol was shown to inhibit 5ar while EE didn't however we know that EE is more powerful at receptor activation. EE is harder on liver, but it increases SHBG much more than natural E.. I think a little bit higher SHBG can help to gobble it any small minuscule amount of androgens that may happen to form in me from adrenals, but too much SHBG could make the natural E less bio-available but luckily SHBG has greater preferential affinity toward Androgens and greater affinity towards DHT than T, and EE unlike E doesn't bind to SHBG.. With all this considered, I'm not sure how much one small birth control pill once a week is doing, I think spreading 2 pills through the week will give me just the right consistency for a small boost while staying in the overall beneficial range. I will take 1 Diane pill on Monday and 1 on Friday, today is Friday so I took 1 already.

Minoxidil

I will continue using 10mg oral minoxidil every other day. However I will start using topical 6%minoxidil / .05% finasteride combo every other day on the alternating days which I don't use oral. Its the Essengen-6 product from MinoxidilMax. Maybe its irrelevant to add finasteride when I already take dutasteride Afaik it is unknown if adding finasteride when already taking .5mg dutasteride everyday will lower more DHT, but I'm sure it won't hurt. Also, it's nice to know I can apply a 5ar inhibitor locally, and I know of no topical min with dutasteride combo which are sold. And now I will seriously be having; finasteride, dutasteride, progesterone and estradiol all in my system which All inhibit 5ar to some extant!

Dexamethasone

I will be applying Dexa topically from an eye drop medication named containing .1% Dexamethasone. I had trouble finding many topicals containing it,, I'm not sure if .1% is alot for dex, but the name of the eyedrops is Maxidex so that seems like a good sign hahaha.. I'm using dexa because there is some cross-talk between the Glucocorticosteriod pathway and the estrogen signaling pathways, in one study, dex was shown to increase dermal aromatase 9x while also downregulating ERa, which in theory should preferentiate the estrogen response to ER beta, which for hair is what we want. However, I know that topical corticosteriods can cause skin atrophy with long term use. I will be applying the eye drops 3 days per week. On Monday Wednesday and Friday. I have already applied it today..

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

OK! To wrap this post up here is my Balls Bomb! :

View attachment 113828

Overkill is better than possibly underestimating and underkilling. I strive for maximizing chemical castration. I don't want even a single molecule of DHT to form!!!!!!!!

I hate male pattern bullshit and I will not let it be a part of me anymore.

Ok, so here's my synergy regimen starting today:

Everyday:
100mg spironolactone
25mg Cyproterone Acetate
6mg Estrofem (2mg 3x per day)
1.5mg Oestrogel
.5mg dutasteride

Every Other Day:
10mg Oral minoxidil
Topical 6% minoxidil / .05% finasteride combo (on alternate days)

10 Days Per Month:
100mg Progesterone (Progestan) (First 10 Nights of the Month)

3 Days Per Week:
Topical .1% Dexamethasone (MaxiDex) (Monday, Wednesday, Friday)

2 Days Per Week:
Diane-35 (Monday, Friday)

where did you get all of this?

 

[bridgeburn]

where did you get all of this?

https://osakado-smp.org/index.php?url=tag/精子形成/

 

[Ikarus]

and yet for some reason doctors would push for ppl to take Anti-depressants instead of effectively treating our hair loss.


you say that now

I agree, doctors need to put their priorities straight instead of making situations worse. I go back to my GP on Friday, where they will give me the final verdict on me taking Spironolactone. If he says yes (I'm hoping he does...) I'm also going to ask about going on Estradiol too (I was too nervous to ask on the original GP appointment). I'm going to ask if I can trial the combination for six to twelve months to see if there is a noticeable difference in hair regrowth and acne reduction, and if there is I can stay on it permanently - but if there isn't, I will be taken off the medications.

I guess in this situation, if the doctor doesn't believe this will work, I will say 'it's better for me to try under medical supervision than me going into a deep depression where the only option ends up being a DIY castration or ordering shady medications online'.

 

[coco_304]

https://osakado-smp.org/index.php?url=tag/精子形成/

english?