Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[KSA]

It is likely that I'm going to regret these 2 months, but considering my case I think waiting is the best approach.
BTW, there is a guy name KSA who had amazing results with Flutamide (essentially an older version of bicalutamide)

Hi! Yes, Flutamide gives fantastic results, but it’s not ideal for men because as a non-steroidal blocker, it will cause your androgens to increase whereas in women, it will actually lead to a bit of estrogen dominance. Granted you’ll regrow hair because the androgens are blocked, but I wish I never took flutamide because coming off of it fucked up my system. You cannot stay on that drug forever. The liver enzyme issue was never a problem for me, and I got tested for that every 6 months for almost 6 years. spironolactone can also increase androgens since it is a very weak inhibitor of steroid production, or such was the case for me. With that said, spironolactone didn’t help me with sebum, but looking back I did have some hair regrowth on spironolactone. Perhaps I’ll consider it again. I would consider Cypro since eventually you can lower the dose and maintain the effect from what I understand. Also topical finasteride is phenomenal. If you can get your hands on it, give it a year.

 

[I'mme]

Hi! Yes, Flutamide gives fantastic results, but it’s not ideal for men because as a non-steroidal blocker, it will cause your androgens to increase whereas in women, it will actually lead to a bit of estrogen dominance. Granted you’ll regrow hair because the androgens are blocked, but I wish I never took flutamide because coming off of it fucked up my system. You cannot stay on that drug forever. The liver enzyme issue was never a problem for me, and I got tested for that every 6 months for almost 6 years. spironolactone can also increase androgens since it is a very weak inhibitor of steroid production, or such was the case for me. With that said, spironolactone didn’t help me with sebum, but looking back I did have some hair regrowth on spironolactone. Perhaps I’ll consider it again. I would consider Cypro since eventually you can lower the dose and maintain the effect from what I understand. Also topical finasteride is phenomenal. If you can get your hands on it, give it a year.

I use topical Finasteride, but I've read mixed reviews about it.

I don't know why you abruptly come off flutamide - you could've reduced the dose, taken it in alternate days etc.

See you took it for six years, that's more than enough. I just want to live my 20' and some part of 30's with full head of hair after which I wouldn't care whether I'm on this earth or not. (I'm 19 at present.)

From what I've read, spirono could be more dangerous when taken for 6+ years. I hope I'm wrong here because trans women must be taking it for years.

 

[I'mme]

14?! how sad, thats a basically a child. damnn, I thought I was amongst the youngest to start losing at 17. but come to think of it, I may have been a late bloomer. I didn't really start masturbating until 17. That was also when I got the most acne and etc. I was so dumb, I literally thought at first that I couldn't be balding because I was too young; it must be my shampoo or vitamin issue. >.< I believed that was something which only happened to like 30 year olds.
If I ever have a kid I will warn them so many times before puberty

I made literally the same excuses. I still take multivitamin and B vits - I started them as I thought my hairloss has been caused by some vitamin deficiency.
I started losing when I was 15 (It was 14 but I tell people 15 just to assure myself that I'm not aberration. This is the first time I've seen fellow balders who started at 14)

 

[Ikarus]

14?! how sad, thats a basically a child. damnn, I thought I was amongst the youngest to start losing at 17. but come to think of it, I may have been a late bloomer. I didn't really start masturbating until 17. That was also when I got the most acne and etc. I was so dumb, I literally thought at first that I couldn't be balding because I was too young; it must be my shampoo or vitamin issue. >.< I believed that was something which only happened to like 30 year olds.
If I ever have a kid I will warn them so many times before puberty

It was not a great situation, because people in my class began mentioning it to me but I just brushed it off. I even went to the doctors about it and she told me it was due to a deficiency in iron, which was a lie because the blood test didn't mention an iron deficiency once I checked. I believe she lied because it would have saved them money; referrals to a dermatologist are costly. Last year, I demanded to see a dermatologist and they finally did. If I ever had a kid, I would make sure to adopt a girl because I don't know how I would emotionally handle being able to have a son who is balding and is devastated about it...

 

[I'mme]

Hi! Yes, Flutamide gives fantastic results, but it’s not ideal for men because as a non-steroidal blocker, it will cause your androgens to increase whereas in women, it will actually lead to a bit of estrogen dominance. Granted you’ll regrow hair because the androgens are blocked, but I wish I never took flutamide because coming off of it fucked up my system. You cannot stay on that drug forever. The liver enzyme issue was never a problem for me, and I got tested for that every 6 months for almost 6 years. spironolactone can also increase androgens since it is a very weak inhibitor of steroid production, or such was the case for me. With that said, spironolactone didn’t help me with sebum, but looking back I did have some hair regrowth on spironolactone. Perhaps I’ll consider it again. I would consider Cypro since eventually you can lower the dose and maintain the effect from what I understand. Also topical finasteride is phenomenal. If you can get your hands on it, give it a year.

Why don't you try Bicalutamide - it's heck a lot safer that flutamide. Basically an upgraded version. Till you somehow have to stop using it (taking the assumption), we'll have 2nd generation Anti-androgens/NSAAs like proxalutamide. (Even Enza or darolua might be more safe; we just don't know yet)

 

[Ikarus]

I use topical Finasteride, but I've read mixed reviews about it.

I don't know why you abruptly come off flutamide - you could've reduced the dose, taken it in alternate days etc.

See you took it for six years, that's more than enough. I just want to live my 20' and some part of 30's with full head of hair after which I wouldn't care whether I'm on this earth or not. (I'm 19 at present.)

From what I've read, spirono could be more dangerous when taken for 6+ years. I hope I'm wrong here because trans women must be taking it for years.

I doubt women would take it for years, unless it's used for acne in which the dose is around 50MG/day. When it comes to female pattern hair loss, women do not prefer spironolactone because it doesn't show results at all. It appears that they generally opt for flutamide since that legitimately is effective for treating FPHL, and that is shown within studies. My mother has FPHL and I warned her not to use spironolactone, since I believe at an older age the chances of it becoming more harmful is heightened, and because it doesn't show results.

 

[I'mme]

I doubt women would take it for years, unless it's used for acne in which the dose is around 50MG/day. When it comes to female pattern hair loss, women do not prefer spironolactone because it doesn't show results at all. It appears that they generally opt for flutamide since that legitimately is effective for treating FPHL, and that is shown within studies. My mother has FPHL and I warned her not to use spironolactone, since I believe at an older age the chances of it becoming more harmful is heightened, and because it doesn't show results.

Oh sh*t! I just ordered it after reading the thread by @AmericanHairlines90. Anyway, it just 50rs (=not even a dollar lol) for 30 days supply.

 

[Member 139756]

It is possible to regrow your hair at that point, there is someone else who did and they used 200MG/day of spironolactone and 8MG/day of estradiol, and minoxidil.

Thanks for helping me. This thread is filled with the nicest people (e.g. you, Noah, Bridgey). A lot of other threads here are just vile.

When you say "at that point", what do you mean exactly?

That late in the hair loss game (i.e. potentially 8 to 10 years after it started), from that pattern of baldness, or after a hair transplant?

Because it's the latter point that I most fear has killed my hopes of regrowth.

Thanks.

Also, if I start taking 200mg spironolactone again (though my testosterone levels are 0.8 and my oestrogen 1900 at the end of my injection cycle - i.e. the lowest point), what
Bicalutamide does should I consider moving to afterwards (at 200mg daily, my spironolactone will only last about 45 more days).

Anybody know much about hair transplants? I am going to go with the clinic offering 2000 over 1500 grafts most likely, via FUT.

I am considering saying "stick it all in the crown except for a slither in the middle-left where it's a bit patchy", and then I will have to hope I can get a third transplant for more thickening / hairline restoration (or hope that my super long vellus hairs along my hairline turn terminal and lower it by half an inch in the process but I have had them for the best part of 9 months with no luck so far).

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

Umm.. Thanks! I will think about taking it at 1.25.

I'm totally fucked up - I don't know what to do. I have DUPA - Diffuse Unpatterned Hairloss - which is said to be rare. Most doctors don't know about it and end up prescribing me the vitamin-mineral pills, huh.
A doctor named W. Rassman say Finasteride works in 50% of people with DUPA. 50% equals "I'm fucked for life".

I'm not even sure if anti-androgens will work or not.

Do you have hair loss on the sides of the head? If not, it is not DUPA, but male pattern baldness.

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

It doesn’t change the fact that spironolactone is also such a weak anti-androgen... It didn’t reduce my facial sebum as expected, nor my scalp sebum. But the tiredness and nausea, I could not even deal with that anymore! It was horrible!

Perhaps you are right. I never used other AA.

 

[I'mme]

Do you have hair loss on the sides of the head? If not, it is not DUPA, but male pattern baldness.

Yes, even on sides. It's just is more aggressive on front of scalp and crown is little slick bald (=my scalp's skin can be easily seens there, multiple people have told me.)

 

[I'mme]

Thanks for helping me. This thread is filled with the nicest people (e.g. you, Noah, Bridgey). A lot of other threads here are just vile.

When you say "at that point", what do you mean exactly?

That late in the hair loss game (i.e. potentially 8 to 10 years after it started), from that pattern of baldness, or after a hair transplant?

Because it's the latter point that I most fear has killed my hopes of regrowth.

Thanks.

Also, if I start taking 200mg spironolactone again (though my testosterone levels are 0.8 and my oestrogen 1900 at the end of my injection cycle - i.e. the lowest point), what
Bicalutamide does should I consider moving to afterwards (at 200mg daily, my spironolactone will only last about 45 more days).

Anybody know much about hair transplants? I am going to go with the clinic offering 2000 over 1500 grafts most likely, via FUT.

I am considering saying "stick it all in the crown except for a slither in the middle-left where it's a bit patchy", and then I will have to hope I can get a third transplant for more thickening / hairline restoration (or hope that my super long vellus hairs along my hairline turn terminal and lower it by half an inch in the process but I have had them for the best part of 9 months with no luck so far).

I don't know if it's just me, but transplanted hair look fake to me, sorry. In my case personally, I would rather get gyno and have it surgically removed than having a hair transplant.

BTW, since you're already on HRT regimen, have you tried oral minoxidil and topical minoxidil combo? That along with other growth stimulants should give you all (most) of your hair back as your T is already plummeted.

 

[Ikarus]

Thanks for helping me. This thread is filled with the nicest people (e.g. you, Noah, Bridgey). A lot of other threads here are just vile.

When you say "at that point", what do you mean exactly?

That late in the hair loss game (i.e. potentially 8 to 10 years after it started), from that pattern of baldness, or after a hair transplant?

Because it's the latter point that I most fear has killed my hopes of regrowth.

Thanks.

Also, if I start taking 200mg spironolactone again (though my testosterone levels are 0.8 and my oestrogen 1900 at the end of my injection cycle - i.e. the lowest point), what
Bicalutamide does should I consider moving to afterwards (at 200mg daily, my spironolactone will only last about 45 more days).

Anybody know much about hair transplants? I am going to go with the clinic offering 2000 over 1500 grafts most likely, via FUT.

I am considering saying "stick it all in the crown except for a slither in the middle-left where it's a bit patchy", and then I will have to hope I can get a third transplant for more thickening / hairline restoration (or hope that my super long vellus hairs along my hairline turn terminal and lower it by half an inch in the process but I have had them for the best part of 9 months with no luck so far).

After being late in the hair loss game; there's a belief that once the hair follicles are miniaturised, they are shut forever. However, that doesn't seem to be the case especially after seeing case after case of people regrowing their hair after basically having none left at all. If you used bicalutamide along with estrogen injections, that will be greatly effective in all honesty. By the way, I'm not knowledgable on hormone levels so is testosterone levels of 0.8 low? What's the normal level for testosterone? And what is the normal levels for estrogen within women? Along with that, you could potentially use a significantly low dose of oral minoxidil which could aid in stimulating the follicles (doses of 0.625MG/day).

 

[Ikarus]

Oh sh*t! I just ordered it after reading the thread by @AmericanHairlines90. Anyway, it just 50rs (=not even a dollar lol) for 30 days supply.

That's so cheap! How much is bicalutamide in India...?

 

[Ikarus]

Why don't you try Bicalutamide - it's heck a lot safer that flutamide. Basically an upgraded version. Till you somehow have to stop using it (taking the assumption), we'll have 2nd generation Anti-androgens/NSAAs like proxalutamide. (Even Enza or darolua might be more safe; we just don't know yet)

I wouldn't recommend enzalutamide due to the possibly to it causing seizures... Although, I wish there was more information on darolutamide.

 

[Member 139756]

I don't know if it's just me, but transplanted hair look fake to me, sorry. In my case personally, I would rather get gyno and have it surgically removed than having a hair transplant.

BTW, since you're already on HRT regimen, have you tried oral minoxidil and topical minoxidil combo? That along with other growth stimulants should give you all (most) of your hair back as your T is already plummeted.

I've already had a massive transplant (see photos above).

In my case I *want* gyno. I am a transgender woman. But HRT doesn't seem to have done or be doing much for my hair.

I have tried both oral and topical minoxidil. I tried topical minoxidil for a year and oral for a month, but the topical only really seemed to make my scalp itchy and sore (especially in the wind) and the oral seemed to make my facial hair grow back (I am only eight sessions into laser removal) and develop some hair between my breasts. Neither seemed to produce a result for my hair loss, though the oral wasn't used long enough for that.

 

[Ikarus]

I've already had a massive transplant (see photos above).

In my case I *want* gyno. I am a transgender woman. But HRT doesn't seem to have done or be doing much for my hair.

I have tried both oral and topical minoxidil. I tried topical minoxidil for a year and oral for a month, but the topical only really seemed to make my scalp itchy and sore (especially in the wind) and the oral seemed to make my facial hair grow back (I am only eight sessions into laser removal) and develop some hair between my breasts. Neither seemed to produce a result for my hair loss, though the oral wasn't used long enough for that.

What is the difference between injections and estrogen tablets which are used sublingually? Are injections stronger?

 

[Member 139756]

After being late in the hair loss game; there's a belief that once the hair follicles are miniaturised, they are shut forever. However, that doesn't seem to be the case especially after seeing case after case of people regrowing their hair after basically having none left at all. If you used bicalutamide along with estrogen injections, that will be greatly effective in all honesty. By the way, I'm not knowledgable on hormone levels so is testosterone levels of 0.8 low? What's the normal level for testosterone? And what is the normal levels for estrogen within women? Along with that, you could potentially use a significantly low dose of oral minoxidil which could aid in stimulating the follicles (doses of 0.625MG/day).

I just don't really see what more I can do to restore my hair on the AA / HRT front.

If hair never truly does die (how I wish that was the case), then surely having less than a 30th to a 100th(!!) of my starting testosterone and over twenty times as much oestrogen should be enough to fix the mess.

As for units... Before treatment my total testosterone levels were around 33 nmol/l. Now they are ranging between 0.3 soon after an injection and 0.8 after 5 days without one.

My total oestrogen levels have risen from, IIRC, sub 100 pmol/l to 1900 pmol/l after 5 days without an injection. The normal range for a cis woman is... I believe 200 to 600 depending on menopause status (except in pregnancy).

So I should go back to the oral minoxidil and hope that the lasers will eventually overpower its hirsute side effects?

This is gonna be awkward with that guy I am super into, but okay.

I am unsure about bothering with topical though. I used it for a year and it only brought me pain.

 

[coco_304]

how much testosterone blocked by 6 mg of androcur?

 

[Member 139756]

What is the difference between injections and estrogen tablets which are used sublingually? Are injections stronger?

Injections are apparently better for the liver and more effective.

Naturally it's the UK that doesn't offer injections for trans women (the UK is super sh*t amongst developed nations for trans people, especially trans women culturally).

I have also used patches and pills in the past, but I was unhappy with the cost to getting sh*t into the female range ratio. Only once I started strong injections did my levels stay constantly in the female range (and for a fraction of the cost). I still have a stockpile of patched and pills. I often take a 2mg tablet a day just to tackle the problem from all angles and because reasons.

I work for the NHS, reluctantly. I know that 5mg finasteride, 100mg spironolactone, and 8mg oestradiol valerate tablets cost the NHS about £10 a month to procure. I checked. And yet when I first wanted finasteride I had to pay £160 through my GP for a month's 1mg supply.