Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[I'mme]

That's so cheap! How much is bicalutamide in India...?

Expensive - not much but not less either, just expensive.

Here's a screenshot. This one is offered by a renowned company, Cipla. For other companies the price may hover around 350. So, for a month 350×3.

 

[I'mme]

I wouldn't recommend enzalutamide due to the possibly to it causing seizures... Although, I wish there was more information on darolutamide.

Iirc, it is around 0.2%. If this is true, I'd bet on it.

 

[I'mme]

A minor update: I've added oral minoxidil back to my regimen, since I've gotten hold of Eflornithine cream which I may use in case I happen to grow hair at random places.

 

[Ikarus]

Injections are apparently better for the liver and more effective.

Naturally it's the UK that doesn't offer injections for trans women (the UK is super sh*t amongst developed nations for trans people, especially trans women culturally).

I have also used patches and pills in the past, but I was unhappy with the cost to getting sh*t into the female range ratio. Only once I started strong injections did my levels stay constantly in the female range (and for a fraction of the cost). I still have a stockpile of patched and pills. I often take a 2mg tablet a day just to tackle the problem from all angles and because reasons.

I work for the NHS, reluctantly. I know that 5mg finasteride, 100mg spironolactone, and 8mg oestradiol valerate tablets cost the NHS about £10 a month to procure. I checked. And yet when I first wanted finasteride I had to pay £160 through my GP for a month's 1mg supply.

I hate the NHS greatly. I was lucky that my dermatologist prescribed spironolactone to me, after emotionally manipulating her. She even referred me to an endocrinologist, in which I will say I am non-binary and ask for bicalutamide; although I am not non-binary, I have seen that bicalutamide and tamoxifen is used for treating them.

I don’t like how the NHS prescribes medications based on gender, and use the excuse of the medications not being licensed for treating hair loss. However, they prescribe spironolactone/cyproterone acetate/flutamide to women for treating female pattern hair loss yet those medications aren’t licensed for treating androgenic alopecia either. It’s an evident double standard, and it makes me irritated.

 

[I'mme]

I just don't really see what more I can do to restore my hair on the AA / HRT front.

If hair never truly does die (how I wish that was the case), then surely having less than a 30th to a 100th(!!) of my starting testosterone and over twenty times as much oestrogen should be enough to fix the mess.

As for units... Before treatment my total testosterone levels were around 33 nmol/l. Now they are ranging between 0.3 soon after an injection and 0.8 after 5 days without one.

My total oestrogen levels have risen from, IIRC, sub 100 pmol/l to 1900 pmol/l after 5 days without an injection. The normal range for a cis woman is... I believe 200 to 600 depending on menopause status (except in pregnancy).

So I should go back to the oral minoxidil and hope that the lasers will eventually overpower its hirsute side effects?

This is gonna be awkward with that guy I am super into, but okay.

I am unsure about bothering with topical though. I used it for a year and it only brought me pain.

You may also use the cream I mentioned in my previous reply. It must be expensive there though.

 

[Ikarus]

Expensive - not much but not less either, just expensive.

Here's a screenshot. This one is offered by a renowned company, Cipla. For other companies the price may hover around 350. So, for a month 350×3.

What is 350 in dollars?

 

[I'mme]

What is 350 in dollars?

5 dollar. So it's 15 dollars for a month. As I said, it okayish pice.

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

That's What I was planning. I've just ordered spironolactone after reading many success stories.
There's some chances of gyno (about 50%), so I would keep tamoxifen in hand.

Take raloxifene for gyno. Tamox will surely increase your hair loss. However, both of them are not good for hair but ralox is a bit better than tamox.

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

Oh sh*t! I just ordered it after reading the thread by @AmericanHairlines90. Anyway, it just 50rs (=not even a dollar lol) for 30 days supply.

Usually, women do not respond to spironolactone because often their hair loss is not related to androgens. However, to combat hair loss, you need at least 200 mg of spironolactone.

 

[I'mme]

Take raloxifene for gyno. Tamox will surely increase your hair loss. However, both of them are not good for hair but ralox is a bit better than tamox.

Okay. I will consider raloxifene. Actually, there's one study which concluded that ralox was better at reducing gyno. So yaa.

 

[I'mme]

Usually, women do not respond to spironolactone because often their hair loss is not related to androgens. However, to combat hair loss, you need at least 200 mg of spironolactone.

200mg seems like an overkill for me, but since I've already ordered I will try at at 100mg. It's also a diuretic, so I might be able to increase my oral minoxidil doses.

 

[KSA]

I doubt women would take it for years, unless it's used for acne in which the dose is around 50MG/day. When it comes to female pattern hair loss, women do not prefer spironolactone because it doesn't show results at all. It appears that they generally opt for flutamide since that legitimately is effective for treating FPHL, and that is shown within studies. My mother has FPHL and I warned her not to use spironolactone, since I believe at an older age the chances of it becoming more harmful is heightened, and because it doesn't show results.

It’s tough to wean off Flutamide because you come off to very elevated androgens. If I titrated my dose down to 350mg instead of 500mg, I would start breakout all over my back. I didn’t have significant acne since I was 16, but on Flutamide, every time I tried to slowly wean off - I would flare up into horrible cystic acne. There was a time in June last year when I went back on Flutamide for 3-5 days because I was frustrated with Spironolactone and I remember my testosterone (free and total) and DHT shot up instantly by almost 200 ng/dl. While this means it was blocking the androgens from their receptor for certain, remember that if and when do you try to wean off, you do have to deal with that level so I do not advise it.
Also, you're very young and I highly doubt you need to jump onto a high unsustainable regimen like a non-steroidal AA. Remember, Androgenetic Alopecia is miniaturization of follicles - they don't just die when they shed out. This whole thread and @bridgeburn 's success is a testament to that. Good luck.

I doubt women would take it for years, unless it's used for acne in which the dose is around 50MG/day. When it comes to female pattern hair loss, women do not prefer spironolactone because it doesn't show results at all. It appears that they generally opt for flutamide since that legitimately is effective for treating FPHL, and that is shown within studies. My mother has FPHL and I warned her not to use spironolactone, since I believe at an older age the chances of it becoming more harmful is heightened, and because it doesn't show results.

That isn't entirely true. Androgenetic Alopecia is in dialogue with both genetic sensitivity and hormone levels. Spironolactone being comparatively weaker than Flutamide can be very impactful for those whose androgen sensitivity is not too high or those whose androgens were not too elevated in the first place. spironolactone also takes about 2 months to "kick in" really, but it definitely works for FPHL. 3 women I am extremely close to - one being my dermat, have had phenomenal success with spironolactone for hair loss and have no desire to try Flutamide (mind you not one of them took more than 100mg and one of them didn't even use Minoxidil).
I don't recommend Flutamide as a first line of therapy, although I hate the diuretic effect of spironolactone.
Also with cis-women, it's a bit different from what I have understood from my doctors - spironolactone and Flutamide can lead to a bit of estrogen dominance, and if you're on an OCP - your hormonal levels can be altered and managed with HRT and you can actually wean off your hair loss drugs unlike the case with men.

 

[Ikarus]

5 dollar. So it's 15 dollars for a month. As I said, it okayish pice.

That’s cheap! I currently pay around $35 for a months supply of bicalutamide... I am hoping to get it on prescription, since it will be free.

 

[Ikarus]

It’s tough to wean off Flutamide because you come off to very elevated androgens. If I titrated my dose down to 350mg instead of 500mg, I would start breakout all over my back. I didn’t have significant acne since I was 16, but on Flutamide, every time I tried to slowly wean off - I would flare up into horrible cystic acne. There was a time in June last year when I went back on Flutamide for 3-5 days because I was frustrated with Spironolactone and I remember my testosterone (free and total) and DHT shot up instantly by almost 200 ng/dl. While this means it was blocking the androgens from their receptor for certain, remember that if and when do you try to wean off, you do have to deal with that level so I do not advise it.
Also, you're very young and I highly doubt you need to jump onto a high unsustainable regimen like a non-steroidal AA. Remember, Androgenetic Alopecia is miniaturization of follicles - they don't just die when they shed out. This whole thread and @bridgeburn 's success is a testament to that. Good luck.


That isn't entirely true. Androgenetic Alopecia is in dialogue with both genetic sensitivity and hormone levels. Spironolactone being comparatively weaker than Flutamide can be very impactful for those whose androgen sensitivity is not too high or those whose androgens were not too elevated in the first place. spironolactone also takes about 2 months to "kick in" really, but it definitely works for FPHL. 3 women I am extremely close to - one being my dermat, have had phenomenal success with spironolactone for hair loss and have no desire to try Flutamide (mind you not one of them took more than 100mg and one of them didn't even use Minoxidil).
I don't recommend Flutamide as a first line of therapy, although I hate the diuretic effect of spironolactone.
Also with cis-women, it's a bit different from what I have understood from my doctors - spironolactone and Flutamide can lead to a bit of estrogen dominance, and if you're on an OCP - your hormonal levels can be altered and managed with HRT and you can actually wean off your hair loss drugs unlike the case with men.

Just to clear something, I definitely wouldn’t recommend flutamide to anyone. I am mainly using flutamide as an example to express the effectiveness of bicalutamide, since they are similar.

 

[Ikarus]

Usually, women do not respond to spironolactone because often their hair loss is not related to androgens. However, to combat hair loss, you need at least 200 mg of spironolactone.

Incorrect. It’s generally due to them having such a significant sensitivity to androgens that spironolactone wouldn’t be effective. Within studies, these women were diagnosed with FPHL but they didn’t respond to spironolactone.

 

[bridgeburn]

I've already organized my regimen which will be:

• 12.5mg of Cyproterone Acetate
• 2-4mg Estradiol Valerate
• 0.5mg Dutasteride (already on it)
• Minoxidil foam once or twice a day (on it since I was 15)
• Dermarolling 1.5mm once a week (doesn't seem to do much but still doing it)

I hope you are taking the valerate buccally/sublingually to bypast first pass metabolism and increase bioavailability. Oral administration may lead to higher estrone and lower igf-1

 

[bridgeburn]

I'd have expected my hair loss to have at least slowed down, but I keep shedding the same amount as I was 6 months ago, with visible worsening. I know the dutasteride is working because my DHT levels are incredibly low, just not on my scalp. Strange.

finasteride and dutasteride can take like a year before results are seen Lol. they are candy compared to Hrt

 

[bridgeburn]

I even went to the doctors about it and she told me it was due to a deficiency in iron, which was a lie because the blood test didn't mention an iron deficiency once I checked.

she should be sued. Iron is definitely not something you want to take unless you have a deficiency. It literally accerlerates the aging process through the formation of Lipofuscin (a toxic byproduct of iron which prevents cellular autophagy)

 

[I'mme]

It’s tough to wean off Flutamide because you come off to very elevated androgens. If I titrated my dose down to 350mg instead of 500mg, I would start breakout all over my back. I didn’t have significant acne since I was 16, but on Flutamide, every time I tried to slowly wean off - I would flare up into horrible cystic acne. There was a time in June last year when I went back on Flutamide for 3-5 days because I was frustrated with Spironolactone and I remember my testosterone (free and total) and DHT shot up instantly by almost 200 ng/dl. While this means it was blocking the androgens from their receptor for certain, remember that if and when do you try to wean off, you do have to deal with that level so I do not advise it.
Also, you're very young and I highly doubt you need to jump onto a high unsustainable regimen like a non-steroidal AA. Remember, Androgenetic Alopecia is miniaturization of follicles - they don't just die when they shed out. This whole thread and @bridgeburn 's success is a testament to that. Good luck.


That isn't entirely true. Androgenetic Alopecia is in dialogue with both genetic sensitivity and hormone levels. Spironolactone being comparatively weaker than Flutamide can be very impactful for those whose androgen sensitivity is not too high or those whose androgens were not too elevated in the first place. spironolactone also takes about 2 months to "kick in" really, but it definitely works for FPHL. 3 women I am extremely close to - one being my dermat, have had phenomenal success with spironolactone for hair loss and have no desire to try Flutamide (mind you not one of them took more than 100mg and one of them didn't even use Minoxidil).
I don't recommend Flutamide as a first line of therapy, although I hate the diuretic effect of spironolactone.
Also with cis-women, it's a bit different from what I have understood from my doctors - spironolactone and Flutamide can lead to a bit of estrogen dominance, and if you're on an OCP - your hormonal levels can be altered and managed with HRT and you can actually wean off your hair loss drugs unlike the case with men.

Actually, I don't think fina is going to do much for me, although I'm gonna give it 2-5 months. That's the reason I'm already looking for alternative treatments which I would rely on. I've bicalutamide in my cart but the issue is, even if it helps I won't be able to take it for long due to its feminizing effects.
I'll be 20 February next year; and if these treatments could make me full head for next ten years, I'd be elated. Who knows something better might come out in between.

 

[bridgeburn]

I specifically remember telling the consultant that I thought it was best to wait to see what HRT would do for me before having the transplant. The a**h** instead convinced me that there was no need because one jumbo, two day transplant and all would be solved anyway. And I believed him, in my state of emotional despair and suicidal feelings.

it pains me that such heartless people exist

Below are some pictures from just over one week ago and one from almost a year ago.

it's thin but it is there, covered in fuzzies rather than slick skin. we just need to thicken those hairs.

I really think you should reconsider oral minoxidil, 70% of non responders to topical respond to oral. It might be the final push you need to unlock the threshold. I know the facial hair sucks but after the scalp hair has strengthened for awhile you could likely maintain on gradually reduced doses.

I'm giving a few quotes from another transwoman on another thread;

"I have been on oral 5mg for ~1 month. I was using foam before for 10+ years. Oral definitely jump started things."

"Of course I am on HRT for a year so it could be that, but I only seemed to thicken up to full thickness in my NW3 area for the year I have been on HRT."

" ANyways most of that is def oral minoxidil...and maybe derma rolling since I started same time. Been on everything else too long for it to be just now working."

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...st-popped-my-first-loniten-pill.107691/page-4

If you click the link, she uploaded pictures on page 5.