Hair is actually an overrated trait

[Rudiger]

Uh, I don't recall saying it's either finasteride or a hair transplant? Obviously after a hair transplant you have to be on finasteride, that's standard procedure for at least a year, but most would be encouraged to just stick with it (I know I would).

 

[Hairon]

Uh, I don't recall saying it's either finasteride or a hair transplant? Obviously after a hair transplant you have to be on finasteride, that's standard procedure for at least a year, but most would be encouraged to just stick with it (I know I would).

I find it stupid that the standard procedure is only for a year, what then? the moment a person stop taking it they will lose their hair, and the hair transplant will be in vain.
I would've gone for a hair transplant myself if I was willing to take finasteride, but I'm not, and so hair transplant is useless for me.

 

[Rudiger]

Ah I understand.

Well there we go, another person who isn't a candidate, and now you get to read about how Fred thinks you're a total loser in every other post he writes.

It's "helping" you.

 

[Hairon]

Ah I understand.

Well there we go, another person who isn't a candidate, and now you get to read about how Fred thinks you're a total loser in every other post he writes.

It's "helping" you.

it's ok I know Fred well enough to know not to take everything he says seriously

 

[Rudiger]

I just hope that's the case for everyone but it obviously it can't be, never mind the amount of guests we get on here.

Is there a reason for not going on finasteride? What about minoxidil or dutasteride?

 

[Hairon]

I just hope that's the case for everyone but it obviously it can't be, never mind the amount of guests we get on here.

Is there a reason for not going on finasteride? What about minoxidil or dutasteride?

I wouldn't go on finasteride so you suggest me dutasteride? isn't it way stronger?
maybe I'd go on minoxidil but it doesn't really help anything does it? without finasteride minoxidil is same as hair transplant, minoxidil doesn't prevent hairloss

I don't go on finasteride because I believe I'll be prone to sides, and I don't want to risk that

 

[Rudiger]

minoxidil actually grew hair for me initially, and it's effects stopped after 2 years, so I don't get why so many people think it doesn't even maintain, never mind grow hair.

Is there any indication you would get sides? Have you looked into the statistical probabilities that you will get them? On top of that it's very, very rare that you would get permanent sides, like lottery winning rare, so after a month or 2 you could stop taking it.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

The sides of finasteride may be rare, but if you get them they're catastrophic. I recommend either avoiding finasteride or at worse, microdosing it at the level of ~0.03 mg/day.

Minoxidil works for a very large number of people, and the only common side effect I've heard of is slightly lower blood pressure. I would try it out. The most likely scenario with minoxidil is that it buys you a few years, which is a great outcome.

 

[Rudiger]

How are they catastrophic? Not being antagonistic or anything but I just thought it was ED until you realise you have ED, then stop taking it, and the effects wear off.

Maybe I'm being naive, I probably have "alpha genes" (not bragging, as we don't have any choice on our genes) and my libido initially was actually stronger for a while. I've never had any issues with ED, even drunk or on drugs, but within a week of taking finasteride I would get a horny thought and it's ready to go, or a girls knee could brush my thigh in bed and literally within a handful of seconds I'd have a full erection.

So obviously I don't understand sides the same way most people do, my view is skewed and when I came to that realisation some months ago I started to feel that it's irresponsible of me to constantly tell people to jump on treatments when I (or anyone else really) doesn't understand the stats of how it affects people, and now your post is telling me not the stats, but how it severely affects people, and this I never understood before.

So yeah, what happens exactly?

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

My thyroid is sluggish to boot. My TSH has been fluctuating for years from 4 to 9. Doctors don't give a f***. Im tired, balding and my scalp itches. Somehow im still lean as f***. My DHT was above normal when I did my tests. If I started oral finasteride and I started gaining weight due DHT loss and estrogen raise I would legit end it.
My only motivation is making money on the internet to f*** 8+ young russian escorts. Im now making enough to f*** one a month, that motivates me. Everything else is absolute dogshit.

My condolences with respect to your thyroid. There are a few people on here with thyroid issues, another one is the poster @Pavi. I hope you guys can discuss things and find better outcomes for the bad hands you've been dealt.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

How are they catastrophic? Not being antagonistic or anything but I just thought it was ED until you realise you have ED, then stop taking it, and the effects wear off.

Maybe I'm being naive, I probably have "alpha genes" (not bragging, as we don't have any choice on our genes) and my libido initially was actually stronger for a while. I've never had any issues with ED, even drunk or on drugs, but within a week of taking finasteride I would get a horny thought and it's ready to go, or a girls knee could brush my thigh in bed and literally within a handful of seconds I'd have a full erection.

So obviously I don't understand sides the same way most people do, my view is skewed and when I came to that realisation some months ago I started to feel that it's irresponsible of me to constantly tell people to jump on treatments when I (or anyone else really) doesn't understand the stats of how it affects people, and now your post is telling me not the stats, but how it severely affects people, and this I never understood before.

So yeah, what happens exactly?

In my humble opinion, permanent erectile dysfunction is a catastrophic outcome.

There's now a modest amount of research on post-finasteride syndrome in addition to the thousands of anecdotes, which is all there was a few years ago. Finasteride inhibits 5AR in each of the skin (good), blood (not so good) and cerebrospinal fluid (terrible). It seems that in the third case, even if you stop taking finasteride, the 5AR might not recover. A huge number of people report side effects that last years after stopping the drugs (so effectively permanent) such as brain fog, depression, erectile dysfunction, slurred speech, impaired sleep, et cetera.

I read a few of the anecdotes and it was depressing so I stopped. There are mediocre solutions out there that sometimes work, such as going on 21-day water-only fasts, testosterone replacement therapy, et cetera.

I was on finasteride for ~1 month at 1.25 mg/day, so I've taken ~38 mg of finasteride in my life. I hope that I did not permanently destroy the allopregnanolone in my cerebrospinal fluid. I was getting slurred speech, reduced ejaculate, and reduced sleep while on finasteride but now that's over. But the side effects might creep on me later.

I'll consider finasteride if I'm diagnosed with prostate cancer. My father got prostate cancer in his 70s, and died in 2012 a few months shy of 78.

ETA: Your alpha-maleness refers only to the effects of finasteride due to the bloodstream changes: less DHT, more T, more E. It has no relevance on what happens to your cerebrospinal fluid.

 

[Rudiger]

Of course permanent erectile dysfunction is catastrophic, but like I said that's lottery winning kind of odds.

What is the result if it affects my cerebrospinal fluid? Slurred speech, reaction times, short term memory loss? And how common would you guess this would be?

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

Of course permanent erectile dysfunction is catastrophic, but like I said that's lottery winning kind of odds.

What is the result if it affects my cerebrospinal fluid? Slurred speech, reaction times, short term memory loss? And how common would you guess this would be?

That's not measured. We just know it's not an isolated occurrence. Lots of people on this forum have reported finasteride sides. There are .... thousands? of users on propeciahelp forums.

Here's Alex Miller's hypothesis, he's a scientist specializing in neuroscience:
http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=85335

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

By the way when I got slurred speech and impaired sleep on finasteride I had no idea that they were finasteride side effects.

I was expecting reduced ejaculate, for example, because I had heard of that one, but not slurred speech nor impaired speech.

Later on I found out that they are common side effects.

 

[Hairon]

don't forget finasteride can also cause gynecomastia which will then force you to spend thousands of dollars on a surgery to remove it

 

[Dante92]

Fred did you actually pay for your hair transplant?

Nah, he probably held the surgeon at gunpoint for the entirety of the procedure.

 

[Hairon]

"
I've never taken finateride and it's been more than 2 years since my hair transplant. Still enjoying the benefits of it.

Finasteride is not mandatory while having a hair transplant. Sorry, you have no excuse. Everyone can be a candidate.

I thought you said you've been always taking finasteride?
but you see what will happen is that a person will do a hair transplant, without taking finasteride, and then after awhile they will keep losing hair around the hair transplant, to the point that their hair will start looking weird and funny, the hair transplant will remain but the hair all around it will start thinning out and fall, then what?
Also I don't live in the USA or Canada, and in my country the hair transplant industry is sh*t, there aren't any good ones, so not only I have to pay for the hair transplant, I'll also have to pay for the flight tickets + hotels and all other expenses, only the tickets to NA/canada cost around $3000
do you realize how much money all of that along with the hair transplant would be?
not to mention that after few years I'd have to repeat all that due to more hair loss

 

[Roberto_72]

I thought you said you've been always taking finasteride?
but you see what will happen is that a person will do a hair transplant, without taking finasteride, and then after awhile they will keep losing hair around the hair transplant, to the point that their hair will start looking weird and funny, the hair transplant will remain but the hair all around it will start thinning out and fall, then what?
Also I don't live in the USA or Canada, and in my country the hair transplant industry is sh*t, there aren't any good ones, so not only I have to pay for the hair transplant, I'll also have to pay for the flight tickets + hotels and all other expenses, only the tickets to NA/canada cost around $3000
do you realize how much money all of that along with the hair transplant would be?
not to mention that after few years I'd have to repeat all that due to more hair loss

Care to say where you from? Your profile actually says USA.

 

[Hairon]

Care to say where you from? Your profile actually says USA.

I'm from israel

 

[Hairon]

"
Half of it, I paid 2250€, and my mother paid the other half, and it was easy, because she doesn't have a mortgage. My parents have always been renting. And I'm glad they did, otherwise, I would have gotten the: "Oh no I can't afford that, we need to pay the mortgage!" F-ing American mentality, ridiculous.

You don't know what you're talking about, Fred.
taking a mortgage will guarantee the property, and owning a property is always better than renting.
When you rent a place, you pay for something that isn't yours, at any given moment, out of the blue, your renter could decide and let you know that once the renting contract is over, they no longer interested in renting you the place, and then you'll have to move and look for another place, if you keep renting places, that could happen to you at any age in any state of life.

When you buy a house or an apartment, that place is now yours, you're the owner, you can do whatever you want with it, and once the mortgage is over, you get yourself a property, with no more money to spend on it, then you'll get pure income by renting it or doing whatever.
plus no one will ever force you to move out of your own property.
the same people you rent your place from are the people who bought those places with mortgage, they invested in it and now they see the fruits of it.

Owning property is always better than renting it, always.