Italian Hair Loss Lotion To Hit The Market In 2016

[Bigoldben]

Here are the two main things that stood out. Quotes are pulled directly from the study:

1)"Subjects were instructed to apply the lotion (approximately 1 ml) on the portion of the scalp showing more hair thinning or loss, and then spread it all over while applying a gentle massage to favor absorption. Application was to be carried out once a day for 6 months."

So basically a 30ml lotion will only last us a 30days maximum (not even considering the fact that most will apply over 1ml)... 70 euros a month... No thanks

2)"No significant differences were observed in men regarding the total number of hair at any control visits in comparison to baseline, yet men experienced a constant improvement. At the end of treatment (6 months) 63.3% of them had experienced an increase in total hair number and the percent change of total hair count after 6 months was +1.6% compared to baseline."

What does this even mean, they are literally contradicting themselves within the same paragraph... This is just scratching the surface, anyhow looking at the tables etc it is very underwhelming so please do not get your hopes up guys.

If i am not mistaken, both Propecia and Minoxidil showed pretty significant results in terms of change in hair count at the 6 month mark, Brotzu from what i have gathered from this poorly carried out study and paper shows next to nothing.

I've seen the whole study, both your points are causes for concern. But on 1 it's not too different to what we've heard before. On 2 I think the answer is that they don't consider 1.6% to be significant.

It is becoming increasingly obvious that this is really a maintenance option with the chance of regrowth. In other words Propecia but more expensive and without the sides. The hope is surely that Beps' claim that three days a week will suffice for maintenance is correct and that the younger you are the better. If it is possible that three days a week will suffice for maintenance the price is down to around 30-35 euros so around double the price of finasteride without the obvious health implications. The report concedes the study's limitations, that they need a larger age profile and that they need longer. The first one you'd have to question why they didn't get younger people in, the second you have to be careful what you wish for. If they had done a five year test and announced amazing maintenance it'd be 4 and a half years down the line for us.

What it also doesn't do is explain the break down of its statistics, it says 63.3% experienced an increase but doesn't say which of the rest achieved maintenance. It says improvement was 1.6% but it doesn't say if that's the mean across the improvements or across all participants. Or the breakdown of those results, for example whether the younger ones did do better on it as was suggested.

In effect what Fidia seem to have created is at worst (unless the whole thing is complete and utter made up bullshite, which is possible) a maintenance option and effective and safe one at that. What they have not done is create the miracle cure or anything close to it. Whether or not the study is a disappointment depends on where you sit currently I suppose. As a relative NW1 maintenance would suffice for me, I'd be slightly disappointed as I'd love my hair to be as thick as it once was but I wish many, many things. If you're NW3, 4, 5 etc. then you have cause for anger. Firstly because it's two years late, secondly because you'd been promised five years and you probably won't get it. But, again taking the study at face value, what this means is that people, or at least people who can afford it, don't have to lose their hair anymore because the maintenance option is there. If it maintenance it has the potential to safely keep you hirsute until a better option comes potentially later.

 

[vegetassj]

How can that old motherfucker say that everyone had robust and shiny hair after 90days, if the study shows NOTHING happens? Can s.o. please beat the sh*t out of those scammers?

 

[Jimm]

Just can’t believe Brotzu posts this sh*t like it’s some sort of recompense. Talk about grasping at f*****g straws. I think the man has destroyed his own reputation on his own by seemingly making no acknowledgement of this study’s conclusions relative to tried and tested products and their corresponding studies .

 

[Yepesyellow]

In effect what Fidia seem to have created is at worst (unless the whole thing is complete and utter made up bullshite, which is possible) a maintenance option and effective and safe one at that.

I don’t think we can really conclude that at all given the size of the study, the length of the study and the age range of participants. If it was sideless maintenance that’d be great but it really doesn’t seem as though that is the case at all.

 

[Bigoldben]

I don’t think we can really conclude that at all given the size of the study, the length of the study and the age range of participants. If it was sideless maintenance that’d be great but it really doesn’t seem as though that is the case at all.

Fair point I jumped the gun somewhat, Fidia have created a maintenance product that works for most people for 6 months. Ideally they would provide a longer study but a longer study would mean a later release date. The fact is we are a month from arrival, we have at this point testimony from replica users that it works in the short term (no idea on the long term), study data that suggests (in the short term) it provides maintenance and lastly photos that appear to show at least maintenance (highly debatable I know, it it longer hair etc.).

In other words the logical thing would be to sit back and wait for release and then try it or wait for others to try it. Hairloss scams simply won't work for long in the internet age as if it is a bust people will spread it around immediately. I am going to try it for two to three months with a small amount on my hairline as the rest of my hair is still pretty thick, that way for a relatively (relatively being the operative word) small amount I can figure its efficacy on me. I'll more than happily let you know if/when I get results or if (as is highly possible) I get nothing at all. The more of us who do that the better we can judge it. The dream is that this maintains long enough for rch-01.

 

[The 7TH Sense]

I've seen the whole study, both your points are causes for concern. But on 1 it's not too different to what we've heard before. On 2 I think the answer is that they don't consider 1.6% to be significant.

It is becoming increasingly obvious that this is really a maintenance option with the chance of regrowth. In other words Propecia but more expensive and without the sides. The hope is surely that Beps' claim that three days a week will suffice for maintenance is correct and that the younger you are the better. If it is possible that three days a week will suffice for maintenance the price is down to around 30-35 euros so around double the price of finasteride without the obvious health implications. The report concedes the study's limitations, that they need a larger age profile and that they need longer. The first one you'd have to question why they didn't get younger people in, the second you have to be careful what you wish for. If they had done a five year test and announced amazing maintenance it'd be 4 and a half years down the line for us.

(...)

In effect what Fidia seem to have created is at worst (unless the whole thing is complete and utter made up bullshite, which is possible) a maintenance option and effective and safe one at that. What they have not done is create the miracle cure or anything close to it. Whether or not the study is a disappointment depends on where you sit currently I suppose. As a relative NW1 maintenance would suffice for me, I'd be slightly disappointed as I'd love my hair to be as thick as it once was but I wish many, many things. If you're NW3, 4, 5 etc. then you have cause for anger. Firstly because it's two years late, secondly because you'd been promised five years and you probably won't get it. But, again taking the study at face value, what this means is that people, or at least people who can afford it, don't have to lose their hair anymore because the maintenance option is there. If it maintenance it has the potential to safely keep you hirsute until a better option comes potentially later.

I'm trying to not get mad while typing this, because this maintenance claim is really getting on my nerves expecially after me and a bunch of other people dismantled the certainty that some of you have of this aspect already several times.

But maybe you have a valid theory bro. Please answer me then:

First study of the numerous one I already read in these years, found on google typing "6 months results minoxidil":

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/2073205/

" One hundred and sixty nine men with early male pattern baldness (androgenic alopecia) were treated in a random, double-blind fashion with either 2% minoxidil solution or placebo vehicle for 24 weeks, one ml applied twice daily. After 24 weeks all patients received the active solution until week 48. After 24 weeks the minoxidil treated patients had increased their non-vellus hair counts significantly more than the placebo treated group; means were 37.6 and 8.8 hairs per reference area, 95% C.I. for difference = 10.85 to 60.75. The rate of non-vellus hair regrowth was also greater among minoxidil treated patients than placebo treated patients. "

This study was 6 months. Trinov study covers 6 months.

Now, using your logic on the above, 'if the study is not uttermade bullshit in any form, we can not dispute the fact that minoxidil treatment provides safe and solid maintenance'. Even better than Brotzu, then, which gets outperformed. Minoxidil 2% is also now at my pharmacy at 15€ for 100 ml (galenic).

Now, one of the most famous minoxidil studies (Bryan's favourite), Vera Price's one (attached):

From the conclusions:
" This study demonstrates that 5% and 2% topical minoxidil promote hair growth and retard the hair loss process over 96 weeks, with 5% topical minoxidil having the greater efficacy. "

Now please, man, explain me exactly how this lotion can't decline overtime like minoxidil and why you said it's as effective as Propecia. Don't get me wrong: I desperately need some hope, it's since the 14th of April (day of Sitri) that I have mental breakdowns everyday over the destiny of my hair. Please explain in details why this lotion is without a doubt as good as propecia in maintaining hairs. Please do it because I really need some hope in these days. My right and left temple is receding (and I want to die when I look at them now) while on 5% minoxidil and topical AAs after a great improvement and I'm 1.5 years in. I am in line with minoxidil studies. Please demonstrate to me how this lotion can maintain unlike minoxidil, carefully avoiding to be biased by your wishful thinking that makes you feel this will preserve your NW1 without finasteride.
I really need to be convinced that this lotion maintains as equal as finasteride.


EDIT:
Sorry man, I didn't read your last post, I was typing.

(...) The fact is we are a month from arrival, we have at this point testimony from replica users that it works in the short term (no idea on the long term), study data that suggests (in the short term) it provides maintenance and lastly photos that appear to show at least maintenance (highly debatable I know, it it longer hair etc.). (...)

Don't worry man, you don't need no more to answer to my post, you explained it here.


I think we're fucked.

 

[Javell]

I think we're fucked.

Yes we are, even finasteride doesn't always work when it is aggressive hair loss.

 

[centurie]

I'm trying to not get mad while typing this, because this maintenance claim is really getting on my nerves expecially after me and a bunch of other people dismantled the certainty that some of you have of this aspect already several times.

But maybe you have a valid theory bro. Please answer me then:

First study of the numerous one I already read in these years, found on google typing "6 months results minoxidil":

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/2073205/

" One hundred and sixty nine men with early male pattern baldness (androgenic alopecia) were treated in a random, double-blind fashion with either 2% minoxidil solution or placebo vehicle for 24 weeks, one ml applied twice daily. After 24 weeks all patients received the active solution until week 48. After 24 weeks the minoxidil treated patients had increased their non-vellus hair counts significantly more than the placebo treated group; means were 37.6 and 8.8 hairs per reference area, 95% C.I. for difference = 10.85 to 60.75. The rate of non-vellus hair regrowth was also greater among minoxidil treated patients than placebo treated patients. "

This study was 6 months. Trinov study covers 6 months.

Now, using your logic on the above, 'if the study is not uttermade bullshit in any form, we can not dispute the fact that minoxidil treatment provides safe and solid maintenance'. Even better than Brotzu, then, which gets outperformed. Minoxidil 2% is also now at my pharmacy at 15€ for 100 ml (galenic).

Now, one of the most famous minoxidil studies (Bryan's favourite), Vera Price's one (attached):
View attachment 103194

View attachment 103196

From the conclusions:
" This study demonstrates that 5% and 2% topical minoxidil promote hair growth and retard the hair loss process over 96 weeks, with 5% topical minoxidil having the greater efficacy. "

Now please, man, explain me exactly how this lotion can't decline overtime like minoxidil and why you said it's as effective as Propecia. Don't get me wrong: I desperately need some hope, it's since the 14th of April (day of Sitri) that I have mental breakdowns everyday over the destiny of my hair. Please explain in details why this lotion is without a doubt as good as propecia in maintaining hairs. Please do it because I really need some hope in these days. My right and left temple is receding (and I want to die when I look at them now) while on 5% minoxidil and topical AAs after a great improvement and I'm 1.5 years in. I am in line with minoxidil studies. Please demonstrate to me how this lotion can maintain unlike minoxidil, carefully avoiding to be biased by your wishful thinking that makes you feel this will preserve your NW1 without finasteride.
I really need to be convinced that this lotion maintains as equal as finasteride.


EDIT:
Sorry man, I didn't read your last post, I was typing.


Don't worry man, you don't need no more to answer to my post, you explained it here.


I think we're fucked.

Also can we all please pay attention to how the placebo groups in all these studies noticed slight improvement to begin with (the famous placebo effect) and also the fact that a proper study has a control group.

Notice how the Brotzu/ Trinov study did not even have a control group. Hence whose saying that these minimal results notice were just down to placebo effect. Sorry to say but i don't even think that this lotion will be able to maintain anyone's hair long term...

 

[Yepesyellow]

I think we're fucked.

While I have you here, what are your thoughts on the timeline for p3074? I would hope that the phase III results will be released by the year’s end.

 

[hairnohair]

Was it "c***" that made it aggressive? Don't read too much into things. I promise I'm not mad at you.

No worries mate, my point was that male pattern baldness is unpredictable. Some people go from NW1 to 5 in less then one year, others just stop losing for a while, others recede to NW3 and stay there for their whole life. Aside from the personal fear of getting off treatment, I don't think maintenance alone can prove the effectiveness of it.

 

[hairnohair]

If you were relying on Brotzu to forget about male pattern baldness forever, you were fucked from the very start. No offence to any of you guys but this was never going to be the cure, right from the start. I've been looking forward to Follicum, don't know why the hell no one cares about it when it was already able to turn leg vellus hair into terminal on the first human trial.

 

[NilesCrane]

God damn everytime I come to this thread I leave even more disappointed

 

[cratusg]

Seriously. They did the opposite in the study to what brotzu said from the beginning. He told us it works best on young guys which have recently started loosing hair and what did the study show. Older men with far gone hair loss beyond repair. Why do you Believe they do this? Let me tell you: because they want to leave us with a glimmer of hope to Think about and make us buy it: only 6 Month study, might work better once we hit 12, Only tested in older men while we ve been told it works best in younger guys. I love u guys but ffs use your brain, dont be naive. I can garantee you will be disappointed if you believe in this lotion.

 

[klerik]

What I don't understand is how they have had the patent for ages and still the longest trial they did was 6 months. I am still hoping that before it starts selling they publish a longer study assuming they have one.

 

[Dinnosaur]

If you were relying on Brotzu to forget about male pattern baldness forever, you were fucked from the very start. No offence to any of you guys but this was never going to be the cure, right from the start. I've been looking forward to Follicum, don't know why the hell no one cares about it when it was already able to turn leg vellus hair into terminal on the first human trial.

Majority of us are not looking for a Cure in this. We are hoping for something that is going keep our hair without side effects until we find something better to replace it with. A waiting game is not a solution for hair loss, it degrades whenever it wants and however it wants.

 

[Jimm]

I'm trying to not get mad while typing this, because this maintenance claim is really getting on my nerves expecially after me and a bunch of other people dismantled the certainty that some of you have of this aspect already several times.

But maybe you have a valid theory bro. Please answer me then:

First study of the numerous one I already read in these years, found on google typing "6 months results minoxidil":

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/2073205/

" One hundred and sixty nine men with early male pattern baldness (androgenic alopecia) were treated in a random, double-blind fashion with either 2% minoxidil solution or placebo vehicle for 24 weeks, one ml applied twice daily. After 24 weeks all patients received the active solution until week 48. After 24 weeks the minoxidil treated patients had increased their non-vellus hair counts significantly more than the placebo treated group; means were 37.6 and 8.8 hairs per reference area, 95% C.I. for difference = 10.85 to 60.75. The rate of non-vellus hair regrowth was also greater among minoxidil treated patients than placebo treated patients. "

This study was 6 months. Trinov study covers 6 months.

Now, using your logic on the above, 'if the study is not uttermade bullshit in any form, we can not dispute the fact that minoxidil treatment provides safe and solid maintenance'. Even better than Brotzu, then, which gets outperformed. Minoxidil 2% is also now at my pharmacy at 15€ for 100 ml (galenic).

Now, one of the most famous minoxidil studies (Bryan's favourite), Vera Price's one (attached):
View attachment 103194

View attachment 103196

From the conclusions:
" This study demonstrates that 5% and 2% topical minoxidil promote hair growth and retard the hair loss process over 96 weeks, with 5% topical minoxidil having the greater efficacy. "

Now please, man, explain me exactly how this lotion can't decline overtime like minoxidil and why you said it's as effective as Propecia. Don't get me wrong: I desperately need some hope, it's since the 14th of April (day of Sitri) that I have mental breakdowns everyday over the destiny of my hair. Please explain in details why this lotion is without a doubt as good as propecia in maintaining hairs. Please do it because I really need some hope in these days. My right and left temple is receding (and I want to die when I look at them now) while on 5% minoxidil and topical AAs after a great improvement and I'm 1.5 years in. I am in line with minoxidil studies. Please demonstrate to me how this lotion can maintain unlike minoxidil, carefully avoiding to be biased by your wishful thinking that makes you feel this will preserve your NW1 without finasteride.
I really need to be convinced that this lotion maintains as equal as finasteride.


EDIT:
Sorry man, I didn't read your last post, I was typing.


Don't worry man, you don't need no more to answer to my post, you explained it here.


I think we're fucked.

Well, this really stuck a dagger in the last iota of hope id kept alive.

 

[Xander94]

Majority of us are not looking for a Cure in this. We are hoping for something that is going keep our hair without side effects until we find something better to replace it with. A waiting game is not a solution for hair loss, it degrades whenever it wants and however it wants.

u already have that with wounding + minoxidil + massage + supplements but u are too lazy to do that just like every other retard on this website who thinks minoxidil stops working after 2 years

 

[Longway886]

Rabble rabble rabble

 

[Me Vs DiffuseThinning]

Finasteride:
View attachment 103189

Trinov:
View attachment 103190
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The first study is what the 7th sense compared it to.

LOL TRINOV DOESN'T DO sh*t. WTF

 

[Armando Jose]

Can someone post this pdf?

https://www.docdroid.net/

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/dth.12778
+1

TIA