Under 25 And Balding, What Cures Are You Looking Forward To?

[H]

I'm not sure how many times we'll have to discuss this.

Lamborghinis are too expensive for the masses and yet the company still turns profits on their sports cars every year.

Obviously, this won't be lamborghini price, but the general concept stands.

This will definitely cost more than a conventional transplant with the added bonus of travel expenses, for weeks at a time or back and forth, to the planet's most expensive country.

I just googled that Wayne Rooney's first transplant cost the equivalent of 25k CAD. At a job paying 18$ an hour up here (which most young people don't make), after you'd deduct rent/mortage, insurance, and other costs, that's an entire year's salary. I guarantee you the Tsuji equivalent of that transplant will cost more, but now you'd have to add all these other expenses on top of it.

Most people aren't going to pay this kind of money even if they have the savings, nor will they finance it and go into debt for "just hair." How many guys who are married, with Rooney-level baldness, with two kids, a mortgage, insurance, car payments, etc.'s wives are going to be like "Sure honey, you can spend a down payment on a house's worth to travel to Japan for 3 weeks to get your hair back!" ? — almost none.

Unless you're really lucky and they charge a flat rate, most people aren't going to go through with it when faced with the actual costs involved. It would be far better to wait for the clinics to open near you and get more hair as you can afford it — most here don't feel they have that kind of time.

This compliments my point though why talk about it when most of us will not have access to the therapy its pointless not even an option we should just forget about Tsuji.

 

[shookwun]

Meanwhile most research section gurus are patiently waiting

 

[The Baldy Man]

Meanwhile most research section gurus are patiently waiting

View attachment 61017

I hope I don't look like that by the time the "promising" new treatments come out.

 

[That Guy]

This compliments my point though why talk about it when most of us will not have access to the therapy its pointless not even an option we should just forget about Tsuji.

I enjoy talking about his research because I think it's interesting and it's just the beginning of bigger things that I personally believe will one day render the entire prosthetic industry irrelevant.

But as time has gone on, comparing what they've said in the interview, conventional therapies, how long it's taken tech to become widespread, etc., I just can't see this being a realistic option for anyone who doesn't have a ton of disposable income (rich) or lives in or within close proximity to Japan for years to come.

As such, I'm no longer concerned with "gettin' Tsuji'd" in the foreseeable future; I see it as an insurance policy for when I'm middle-aged.

Shiseido and Follica should be able to provide the kind of results that I would (and many others) would need, they're much closer to being a reality, and would be much more affordable.

 

[Endmymisery]

What is the price range going to be for shiseido?

 

[H]

I enjoy talking about his research because I think it's interesting and it's just the beginning of bigger things that I personally believe will one day render the entire prosthetic industry irrelevant.

But as time has gone on, comparing what they've said in the interview, conventional therapies, how long it's taken tech to become widespread, etc., I just can't see this being a realistic option for anyone who doesn't have a ton of disposable income (rich) or lives in or within close proximity to Japan for years to come.

As such, I'm no longer concerned with "gettin' Tsuji'd" in the foreseeable future; I see it as an insurance policy for when I'm middle-aged.

Shiseido and Follica should be able to provide the kind of results that I would (and many others) would need, they're much closer to being a reality, and would be much more affordable.

To be honest in my opinion I see Shiseido as a finasteride only with less sides and Follica rendering about hair transplant results. We can do these things already and still this site remains full of people unhappy. You caught yourself early and that's great you, I believe, are an nw2 no diffuse correct? A little regrowth could go a long way for you but for people who have advanced farther say even nw3 and on, severely diffuse thinners etc,sparse diffuse hair here and there isn't really going to matter. I know you've stated that Follica can be used more than once maybe but everything besides the fact Follica has a wounding device is completely up in the air. We have no idea if this loses efficacy after the first treatment perhaps the skin does not react the same each time who knows? I just don't believe as you do that Follica is going to help a good chunk of the site members unless they are okay with going a little thicker but still being diffuse. It could very well be a cure for low norwoods and people just starting to thin but I believe most of the people who are most concerned about baldness are the ones who have aggressive advanced hairloss already Shiseido and Follica do not address them they can't but this is my opinion time will tell.

 

[Omega2327]

A lot of it still is, though.

Most of the big deal, theoretical uses for stem cells are still pre-clinical with hurdles both legal and scientific standing in the way from making it a reality. There are presently only 2 stem cell therapies in mainstream use, with bone marrow being by far the most common for the last 40 years.

The word fiction is used to describe something that's not real. Just because stem cell research is extremely advanced, cutting edge, futuristic, etc. doesn't mean that fiction is a fair adjective at all. Stem cell research should not be lumped in the same boat as magic and witchcraft by calling it fiction.

We can reasonably estimate that it will be a lot, though — given what they said in the interview and their proposed business model.

Secondly, the number of people who will be willing to go into that kind of debt for funding, especially when so many have student loans, mortgages, kids, etc. is very small.

But everyone should just forgo all those things in life and should have anticipated the day haircloning would be a reality because hair > life, right? Sorry, I don't buy it; most people outside of Japan, funding or no, are not going to pay all the expenses involved to get all their hair back. It's not like buying cheap pills, spray/foam, shampoos, or small-scale cosmetic surgeries.

I mean yes of course we know it's going to be much more expensive than a normal hair transplant, but no one really knows how much more expensive. There's probably a $100K range people could throw arguments around back and forth, but at the end of the day, no one really knows.

No offense, but I feel like you're being drastic with your hair vs. life ultimatum.

I'll use $50K an example which is a reasonable guess to how much it might cost. I have a good job, but I certainly do not consider myself rich at all. However, in the span of 3 years, I could absolutely save $50K that I would have otherwise put away for retirement (and just from a general tightening of the belt). Hell, maybe I will even work an extra year down the road when I'm nearing retirement to make up for it, but this in no way means that I'm choosing hair over life... And most people on here would probably agree that a cure such as this would increase their quality of life so much that in some sense it would give them the life they really want. So let's certainly not neglect the potential impact of a true cure. We're all on here for a reason - because hair loss is something that affects us very deeply. So yeah it would be damn well worth it to me and I would not be sacrificing much at all, especially when I think about the huge positive impact it would have on my life. Nor do I think I'm in this "very small rich minority". I do agree that there is probably a large percentage that would just not be able to afford it from the get go. The average person might not be able to reasonably pay for it at the beginning. But no, I don't think the scale is tipped as heavily as you lead on.

Also, I really feel like you're pretty hung up on that idea that "living outside of Japan" is going to make it soo much more difficult. That means almost nothing. That is an extra $5K in travel expenses, which is rather immaterial if you're already spending $50K... and no I don't think I need to spend 3 weeks in Japan. I'd likely fly up once to have the sample taken and then again weeks later for the actual procedure.

 

[ForeverBald]

you could save $50k in 3 years, me and the peole in my country save it in 20 years LOL

 

[Christian Miller]

you could save $50k in 3 years, me and the peole in my country save it in 20 years LOL

C' est la vie.
We are talking about the developed world.
30,000-50,000$ ain't that difficult to save within a five-year frame.

 

[MrV88]

C' est la vie.
We are talking about the developed world.
30,000-50,000$ ain't that difficult to save within a five-year frame.

Just one word :LOL
Even if you live in Germany you can't save that amount of money. People have to live and life gets much more expensive by the day. Fresh out of the university and for the next 5 years you won't make more than 1700-2300 net per month roughly 20-30k per year! , half of it is for food, rent etc. And if you are married, boom there goes the dream. People aren't earning that much in developed countries.

That amount of money is really just affordable for +35-40 old guys that already have a very good job at higher ranks or have their own businesses, everything else is just a dream for an average guy.

 

[Christian Miller]

Just one word :LOL
Even if you live in Germany you can't save that amount of money. People have to live and life gets much more expensive by the day. Fresh out of the university and for the next 5 years you won't make more than 1700-2300 net per month roughly 20-30k per year! , half of it is for food, rent etc. And if you are married, boom there goes the dream. People aren't earning that much in developed countries.

That amount of money is really just affordable for +35-40 old guys that already have a very good job at higher ranks or have their own businesses, everything else is just a dream for an average guy.

Let's say you earn 1,700€ per month. And you are single and 25.
You spend 1,000€ on rent, food, etc. You are left with 700€.
Let's say you save 400€. That's ~440$.
440$x12= 5,280$ per year.
In five years, you will have saved 5,280$x5=26,400$.
You get a 20,000€ loan at the age of 30.
That's 22,000$.
26,400$+22,000$=48,400$.
Voilà.
You are almost fuckin' there.
And that's mid 2022.
You are thirty, with a nice flock of hair, eager to conquer the world, and with a minor load on your shoulders.

(Let's say you have to pay back the loan in ten years. 20,000€/(12x10)=~167€, interest free.
Or in five years, 20,000€/(12x5)= ~333€.)

It's feasible, arkadaș, oder?

 

[MrV88]

Let's say you earn 1,700€ per month. And you are single and 25.
You spend 1,000€ on rent, food, etc. You are left with 700€.
Let's say you save 400€. That's ~440$.
440$x12= 5,280$ per year.
In five years, you will have saved 5,280$x5=26,400$.
You get a 20,000€ loan at the age of 30.
That's 22,000$.
26,400$+22,000$=48,400$.
Voilà.
You are almost fuckin' there.
And that's mid 2022.
You are thirty, with a nice flock of hair, eager to conquer the world, and with a minor load on your shoulders.

(Let's say you have to pay back the loan in ten years. 20,000€/(12x10)=~167€, interest free.
Or in five years, 20,000€/(12x5)= ~333€.)

It's feasible, arkadaș, oder?

A loan for a hair transplantation...such a move is nothing but pure desperation.

5 years of work plus 5-6 years for a loan at the age of 25 is ridiculous. At the age of 35 you would have paid your hair... This ain't a flat or a good car it's still just hair...I would definitely recommend a psychologist if someone is going to do this with such a low amount of income.

 

[That Guy]

No offense, but I feel like you're being drastic with your hair vs. life ultimatum.

Clearly, you haven't talked to that many people on here then; visit the Impact Forum sometime

I'll use $50K an example which is a reasonable guess to how much it might cost.

I have no idea what job you work or where you live where saving up $50K is a completely reasonable goal in 3 years, but for where I'm from it is simply not.

Most young people are not making the money that even I am, I consider myself pretty lucky. Most people my age, who haven't sold their souls to the oilfield, are making around 11 - 14 dollars an hour in dead-end jobs to pay off their student loans and struggle to cover the rent on their own — especially in the province of BC, which probably has the most expensive housing market in Canada.

I used the example of 18$ an hour (most 25 year olds don't make that) before taxes, and subtracting the average annual rent payment before taxes and no other expenses would leave such a person with just 17k in savings per year. Much less after you subtract all the other living costs. Most of these people also have student loans still to pay off, or they just did pay them off and are having families etc. A debt for cosmetic issues would be a completely insane expense to add on.

In order for the average joe under 30 to be able to afford this, they'd have to make all kinds of lifestyle sacrifices and take on many extra hours or a second job, etc. and I know this is mind-blowing to most people reading this, but most people in the world would consider a down payment's worth on a house spent on hair instead to be completely retarded.

Also, I really feel like you're pretty hung up on that idea that "living outside of Japan" is going to make it soo much more difficult. That means almost nothing. That is an extra $5K in travel expenses, which is rather immaterial if you're already spending $50K

If you're already spending 50k on medical tourism in 3 years time, I imagine 5k is immaterial just on a Tuesday.

do agree that there is probably a large percentage that would just not be able to afford it from the get go. The average person might not be able to reasonably pay for it at the beginning.

Exactly, and the average person is the average poster here minus some of the legitimate insanity.

Allow me to simplify: Unless one is making six figures a year, or close to it, and has been for several years now or up until the treatment comes out, and you have at least 20 - 40% savings per year after all your living expenses, you're unlikely to afford Tsuji in 2020 if you're a high Norwood.

 

[Christian Miller]

A loan for a hair transplantation...such a move is nothing but pure desperation.

5 years of work plus 5-6 years for a loan at the age of 25 is ridiculous. At the age of 35 you would have paid your hair... This ain't a flat or a good car it's still just hair...I would definitely recommend a psychologist if someone is going to do this with such a low amount of income.

1,700€ per month is at the low end of the salary spectrum, arkadaș.
Most Germans make at least 2,000€. The same is true for most French, Dutch, Belgian, Scandinavian, Canadian and American people.
Nonetheless, taking a loan for a procedure that's gonna change your life for the better at the age of 30 is not desperate at all.
Besides, it's supposed that salaries increase annually, in accordance with the expected annual inflation, of course.

 

[MrV88]

1,700€ per month is at the low end of the salary spectrum, arkadaș.
Most Germans make at least 2,000€. The same is true for most French, Dutch, Belgian, Scandinavian, Canadian and American people.
Nonetheless, taking a loan for a procedure that's gonna change your life for the better at the age of 30 is not desperate at all.
Besides, it's supposed that salaries increase annually, in accordance with the expected annual inflation, of course.

Nobody will give this much money if they have to safe it for 7-10!!years for just some damned hair mate. An average guy doesn't earn about 2k, and I really don't care about the official data. Without university degree you get your 6-7euro net per hour and that's all. You simply don't earn that, all the taxes, rents (doubled thanks to the immigrants) and the other things you HAVE to buy. You can't save money if you don't have it for DECADE.

You are just simply saying that a normal person should absolutely have no social life or fun and then save for 7-10 years to get his hair back.

These ideas are ridiculous and how frustrated must a person be to really consider such a crazy idea? (People with higher income are something else, but they still are not an average guy)

 

[sunchyme1]

Nobody will give this much money if they have to safe it for 7-10!!years for just some damned hair mate. An average guy doesn't earn about 2k, and I really don't care about the official data. Without university degree you get your 6-7euro net per hour and that's all. You simply don't earn that, all the taxes, rents (doubled thanks to the immigrants) and the other things you HAVE to buy. You can't save money if you don't have it for DECADE.

You are just simply saying that a normal person should absolutely have no social life or fun and then save for 7-10 years to get his hair back.

These ideas are ridiculous and how frustrated must a person be to really consider such a crazy idea? (People with higher income are something else, but they still are not an average guy)

any ideas on the cost of follica and shielsdo?

from what youve read, how confident are you of these treatments being released in the next couple of years?

 

[That Guy]

1,700€ per month is at the low end of the salary spectrum, arkadaș.
Most Germans make at least 2,000€. The same is true for most French, Dutch, Belgian, Scandinavian, Canadian and American people.
Nonetheless, taking a loan for a procedure that's gonna change your life for the better at the age of 30 is not desperate at all.
Besides, it's supposed that salaries increase annually, in accordance with the expected annual inflation, of course.

Just lol

To be considered "middle class", the true middle, in Canada, you have to make at least 23k if you're single.

Guarantee Tsuji will cost you more than that to go from bald to not. If you made the 55k to be considered "Highest 20%", (all this before taxes) then you'd still likely wind up short in savings after all the costs of living you'll pay here. Especially since most people making that money are living in more expensive places, buying more food, more expensive cars, etc.

To be in the upper 20%, you have to make around 20 bucks an hour, full-time. Most people my age are still beginning to climb corporate ladders or are still in retail jobs earning like 15 - 17 per hour max; the exception is the oilfield.

Most Canadian 18 - 25 year olds, the demographic to whom hairloss is of greatest concern from a social standpoint, are not going to be able to swing this journey to Japan in quest for hair after all of their other costs — sad, but true.

 

[Christian Miller]

Nobody will give this much money if they have to safe it for 7-10!!years for just some damned hair mate. An average guy doesn't earn about 2k, and I really don't care about the official data. Without university degree you get your 6-7euro net per hour and that's all. You simply don't earn that, all the taxes, rents (doubled thanks to the immigrants) and the other things you HAVE to buy. You can't save money if you don't have it for DECADE.

You are just simply saying that a normal person should absolutely have no social life or fun and then save for 7-10 years to get his hair back.

These ideas are ridiculous and how frustrated must a person be to really consider such a crazy idea? (People with higher income are something else, but they still are not an average guy)

Just because you may be in the low end of the income spectrum, it doesn't mean that there aren't many men who make more than 2,000€!
Maybe you cannot afford it.
There are plenty of men who can and are going to make sacrifices to have the procedure, if it works out within the next five years.
Deal with it!

 

[That Guy]

Just because you may be in the low end of the income spectrum, it doesn't mean that there aren't many men who make more than 2,000€!
Maybe you cannot afford it.
There are plenty of men who can and are going to make sacrifices to have the procedure, if it works out within the next fiive years.
Deal with it!

Congrats, you'd still be in the exact middle class of Canadians.

Who either aren't going to have or be willing to part with the savings necessary to afford Tsuji lol

 

[MrV88]

Just because you may be in the low end of the income spectrum, it doesn't mean that there aren't many men who make more than 2,000€!
Maybe you cannot afford it.
There are plenty of men who can and are going to make sacrifices to have the procedure, if it works out within the next fiive years.
Deal with it!

You are living in Fantasyland sorry, but yes I can afford it, but I won't pay such a ridiculous price for hair. Better pay 20-30 more and get a 911 or something more valuable, arkadaş.

any ideas on the cost of follica and shielsdo?

from what youve read, how confident are you of these treatments being released in the next couple of years?

I'm not very confident about Follica, just like a little eh..could be good. Shouldn't be too expensive. minoxidil+ microneedling+x must me affordable to be successful.

Shiseido on the other hand could be much better because of the procedure, technology and thr work of the Japanese people. İf it was for replicel alone I would say scam, but Shiseido didn't change the timeline or made some an announcement that could change something until now. The costs should be around 1k like some guys here mentioned.